| Subscription Base? | |
|
Sajid - The Undertitled  |
I know I should just look this up, but its kind of fun waiting for your responses.
So... Is TOR 100% sure all the way subscription based? If so... Too bad, I can't play it. I'll stick to JA if so... Are you going to shell out the money every month/year/whatever? _______________ Brother to Quill You don't understand. I'm not locked in here with you, YOUR LOCKED IN HERE WITH ME! |
| < Recent Comments | Login and add your comment! |
| Comments |
|
Masta - Jedi Council 
|
I've written something on another thread in the JA which summarizes my opinions on TOR, but I'll just c&p the entire thing here because it seems relevant - wall of text inc:
I agree with that sentiment: TOR gameplay seems incredibly unexciting, and I'd even go as far to say that it's basically WoW with a SW reskin. The devs even said they took inspiration from WoW, because hey, if there's anyone going to make a successful WoW clone EVER, it must be Bioware. Having said that, besides the terrible art direction, the game seems to be a very grindy version of Kotor, where you'll be playing with others now and then. If it's all about the story and individual player's experience, why not just make Kotor3? Instead, they add grind to it, make it multiplayer to make the grind less mind-numbing and slap on a subscription, because hey, you can't justify a grind-free, somewhat casual game with a subscription. In MMOs with subscriptions, in 5 months you'll have played about 10% of the content you would in a normal single player game - mostly because you have to grind X amount to reach content Y, which is not true for single player games at all. You consequently get more bang for your buck with single player games due to the lack of grinding. If you think about it, this is essentially what GW2 will be like as well, since there is no need for them to include grinding. And they've already spoken numerous times about their strong anti-grind policy. But Bioware is essentially going to take Kotor3, pad it out, add parts that you have to replay over and over and over, then slap an MMORPG genre tag on it, a subscription, and call it done. And that's better than them just making Kotor3, is it? This is the reason I can't possibly be excited about this game, it looks like a cheap cash-in because the art style is cheap and nasty, and it sounds like one because there's a subscription. In five months of TOR you won't have experienced 10% of the content you did in completing Portal 2 in one day. And this is why MMORPGs with grind are bad. I'll go on: One irksome rumour that has been mentioned a lot in favour of TOR is that it will feature multiple campaigns the length of Kotor bundled into one. Seriously? How can you possibly develop a number of games the length of Kotor in the sort time they've been working on TOR? Look how long it took them to put together Mass Effect 2, and that was a relatively short game. (A really good one, but albeit short game) The thing is that I believe people are confusing content with voiceacting: five games worth of voice acting does not five games worth of content make. What I can see is a hell of a lot of padding between sections, repetitive, grindy combat that we'll have to do, which will mean missions that take ten times longer than they should due to padding, and then we'll get to sit through long-winded cutscenes where we have to wait for someone to stop monologuing before we'll get the chance to make a choice. Everything they've showed us thus far backs me up on this point. Go and track down some of the gameplay videos and you'll see that the game is terrible about monologuing. It isn't like Fallout3 where it'll go a few lines and then you get a choice, but often you'll be sitting around on your thumbs waiting for people to stop talking. And, to me, that doesn't equal game content. That equals an audiobook, and probably not the best audiobook ever written, either. I just think that people are seriously deluding themselves with how much game there'll be in TOR versus how much grind. A lot of Bioware's history backs me up on this as well. Consider the following: - Bioware are old hands at grind. They did it a lot in Dragon Age. The deep roads were actually what convinced me to outright stop playing on my last playthrough. Now Mass Effect 2 was a sans grind game by comparison (except for the effing resource gathering) and I appreciate that, but Bioware do know how to pad. They know how to pad with repetitive combat and mind-numbing minigames. There's evidence of this, I don't need to be accused of fabricating anything because anyone who's played a Bioware game knows I'm telling the truth about this. (Mass Effect 2 even would've been better without that hateful minigame.) - Name a subscription-based game (that doesn't have a free to play component) that's without grind. Go on. This isn't picking on Bioware, this is just me knowing about MMORPGs. Dungeons & Dragons Online? That had shedloads of it, where people pointed out how hilarious it was that it took you so long to gain one level in DDO versus tabletop, or how about Lord of the Rings Online? Stop picking on Turbine? Sure, I was just avoiding the big B and their World of Warcraft, how about Everquest II? Warhammer? Age of Conan? Aion? Do you see where I'm going with this? Now, if Bioware had said that they were developing Kotor3-6 then I would've been delighted, but what they've instead done is cannibalised the next two or three kotor games and filled them up with deep roads-like and minigame nonsense. There is just too much evidence to support this to ignore. It's the same old con that every MMORPG with a subscription has used since the dawn of time. And I actually feel sorry for those who trust in Bioware to not do the same. If it didn't have a subscription, my opinion would be a lot different, but that it does have a subscription tells me everything. I was actually mildly interested in TOR (in everything but art style, I always hated that) before they revealed it had a subscription. ------ So yes, to answer Mike's question: yes I would. _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
|
Virtue - Jedi Council 
|
So's your face! _______________ Academy Architect |
|
Monteeeeeee - Nugget 
|
Jedi are gay  _______________ If you add me to MSN, tell me who you are
Best Movie Character EVER!! |
|
Virtue - Jedi Council
|
Epic!
But can I be a Jedi? _______________ Academy Architect |
|
Monteeeeeee - Nugget
|
Quote: Release a sandbox MMO with FPS combat, SWG style space/ship stuff and atmospheric flight, I'd be an ecstatically happy guy - but that probably won't happen for a while, let alone with TOR. So we'll work with what we're given for now. Early Christmas Present for Virtue _______________ If you add me to MSN, tell me who you are
Best Movie Character EVER!! |
|
Virtue - Jedi Council
|
It's great to see everyone's opinions and comments about TOR, at the end of the day, some people have played the beta and thought it wasn't too bad, others have not really liked it.
At the end of the day though, we can't really judge until the full game is launched, and to be fair, name ONE MMO that has had absolutely phenomenal reviews upon launch, even WoW had to go through a few patches before it was "the most successful MMO on the market". Bottom line, it'll be released, people will play it and it will be patched depending on what the majority of the community talk (or whine) about. So we can't realistically make judgements on what the game it'll be like upon release, before it is released. Now, there are people here who generally prefer FPS games and have never really got into MMOs because of the way they're played or the mechanics or whatever, and that it totally cool and I respect that. Heck to be honest, I'm more of an FPS person than MMO person, but I DID love SWG in the Pre-CU era. Release a sandbox MMO with FPS combat, SWG style space/ship stuff and atmospheric flight, I'd be an ecstatically happy guy - but that probably won't happen for a while, let alone with TOR. So we'll work with what we're given for now. So, keep your opinions and keep voicing them, because at the moment, no one is wrong, we simply don't know right now, so it's all valid. We're NOT giving up on JK3 and/or FPS games, and if (even if it's unlikely) that another JK game is released, or another FPS game based around SW that is even LIKE the JK series that we can all play in the same sort of way, we'll jump right into that, too.  _______________ Academy Architect |
|
Monteeeeeee - Nugget
|
Guild wars and guild wars 2 wont sell reduced expansion packs, usually its the same price as the original game but an expansion pack to a Subscription based MMO is usually only $20 - $30
I know the subsciption you pay can easily afford 2 - 3 times a new game before each expansion but your also paying for admins to keep the game balanced etc... Subsciptions aren't for everyone but when you consider its like 4 Cans of Cola a week it's barely nothing. _______________ If you add me to MSN, tell me who you are
Best Movie Character EVER!! |
|
Maher - Jedi Knight 
|
Quote: The free to play label kind of sucks, anyway. Fact is, MMO's are expensive to run and they've got to find money somewhere.
Guild Wars? Guild Wars 2? LineAge? LineAge II? _______________ Still here | My Lightsaber |
|
Monteeeeeee - Nugget
|
Quote:
Quote:
But the game isn't out yet. How could you possibly know what kind of quality it is? And no, beta testing doesn't count.
Quit being such a sour puss, gosh! Beta testing counts for a lot. I cant say much, but from what I've played and seen, its like a crappy star wars themed WoW. Unfortunately, from what I've read, lucasarts is putting all they have into this game. Its make or break time. It just doesn't appeal to me enough to spend the ridiculous amount of money for a mediocre game. It doesn't matter if its Star Wars, if its not fun, why buy it? You claim to of played in the game over a year ago which was Alpha state, so your opinion on the gameplay that you've played is very old. What MMO's do you like ? And bear in mind WoW is the most successfull MMO ever. Is it a bad business model to make your game similar but in a star wars universe ? No it isn't since WoW pretty much dominates end game content and thats what MMO is all about the end game content, the leveling proccess is essentially a single player RPG with some dungeons thrown in to break up the grind. So tell me which MMO's are your favourites and why ? _______________ If you add me to MSN, tell me who you are
Best Movie Character EVER!! |
|
planK - Jedi Council 
|
Quote: It has a subscription. Games that are f2p don't have subscriptions.
But you can play it without paying a bolt for it. That means you can play it for free. That means it's free to play, right? Granted, you can't play all the content they've made, but you can definitely enjoy hours of gameplay for free if that's your kind of thing. Saying that, are free to play games that advertise themselves as such lying? They have microtransactions within their games that have you paying far and beyond what a subscription would cost, for all the content they've made. The only difference is, they let you choose when, and what to pay for. It's hardly free as a whole, but they give you a percentage of the game to play, hoping you'll pay for more. The free to play label kind of sucks, anyway. Fact is, MMO's are expensive to run and they've got to find money somewhere. I don't mind paying a subscription for a big game like SWTOR - I don't think it's *that* expensive, and I'm what a lot of people would consider a broke-ass poor hobo son of a bitch who should wash more often. Anyway, we probably really disagree on this, and that's cool. You're still a sexy bitch. But just out of curiosity, would you play SWTOR if it was a non-subscription, buy the game and it's yours for life kind of affair? |
|
Masta - Jedi Council
|
It has a subscription. Games that are f2p don't have subscriptions. _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
|
planK - Jedi Council
|
It is, kinda. It's like the most heavily restricted f2p mmo out there. |
|
Masta - Jedi Council
|
WoW isn't f2p though. _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
|
Alex Dkana - Staff 
|
Wouldn't be surprised to see it go f2p down the road though. Not due to lack of sucess, but because it's the way things are going. _______________ To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield | Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken | Rhaiko D'kana - SWTOR EU Guild Co-Founder | Is it what the teacher, teaches? Or what the student learns? A Dkana |
|
Masta - Jedi Council
|
Quote: It doesn't matter if its Star Wars, if its not fun, why buy it? The company of good people can turn a crappy experience into a good one. So the fact that a lot of the guys here are really into SW and will buy the game makes it all the more compelling to jump on the bandwagon. _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
|
Sajid - The Undertitled 
|
Quote: But the game isn't out yet. How could you possibly know what kind of quality it is? And no, beta testing doesn't count.
Quit being such a sour puss, gosh! Beta testing counts for a lot. I cant say much, but from what I've played and seen, its like a crappy star wars themed WoW. Unfortunately, from what I've read, lucasarts is putting all they have into this game. Its make or break time. It just doesn't appeal to me enough to spend the ridiculous amount of money for a mediocre game. It doesn't matter if its Star Wars, if its not fun, why buy it? _______________ Brother to Quill You don't understand. I'm not locked in here with you, YOUR LOCKED IN HERE WITH ME! |
|
Masta - Jedi Council
|
Quote: And no, beta testing doesn't count. Yes it does. There's tons of information about the game available everywhere as well, all of which points to the fact that the game will be crap and in no way will it ever justify a subscription. If the game were free, I could overlook the glaring mistakes that Bioware is making, but with a subscription slapped on it, the entire project has become a cash-in on the big and lucrative fanbase that Star Wars has. _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
|
planK - Jedi Council
|
But the game isn't out yet. How could you possibly know what kind of quality it is? And no, beta testing doesn't count.
Quit being such a sour puss, gosh! |
|
Masta - Jedi Council
|
Considering the quality of the game and the existence of amazing alternatives to it, the deal has been long sealed for me. JA be damned. _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
|
planK - Jedi Council
|
Quote: It has nothing to do with Windows. I'm typing from my windows partition right now lol. Its just that I'm not committing to pay monthly or whatever for a game that seems OK at best.
that's fair enough! hopefully when the game is out and some dependable reviews come out (from gaming sites and people here, etc) you'll be able to decide whether or not it's worth the dough. Quote: Yes, this is also the primary reason why I'm not going to be playing it.
And his momma cries, 'cause if there's one thing that she don't need, is another hungry mouth to feed, in the ghettooo! |
|
Sajid - The Undertitled 
|
It has nothing to do with Windows. I'm typing from my windows partition right now lol. Its just that I'm not committing to pay monthly or whatever for a game that seems OK at best. _______________ Brother to Quill You don't understand. I'm not locked in here with you, YOUR LOCKED IN HERE WITH ME! |
|
Masta - Jedi Council 
|
Yes, this is also the primary reason why I'm not going to be playing it.
Quote: Bootcamp one of your macs, you silly goose!
lol _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
|
Mic Den Octela - Student 
|
Ya know, I'm LITERALLY in the middle of writing an article that says this.  _______________ -Padawan of Virtue -Brother of Menaxia, *|irael, Krynn Adept, Majno, Ris Win Juljul, DaMi3N, Beowulf, Dash Starlight, Carrock and Yuken Zalak Bartender at Munes bar. Sir Mic of Nippledom! Proudly beating Wang, since '07. (Crackdown) |
|
Setementor - Jedi Master 
|
Yeah, it's subscription-based. |
|
planK - Jedi Council 
|
Yeah, it's a subscription based game. Bootcamp one of your macs, you silly goose! |
| < Recent Comments | Login and add your comment! |