| File Sharing | |
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CuZzA - Student  |
I feel this topic could be a pretty good debate. What do you think about file sharing programs like Kazaa and Soul Seeker? Personally, i dont think it's illegal. Why? Easy! One person goes to the shops and buys a CD worth £12. That person goes home and uploads it onto his computer. He simply puts the files into his 'My Shared Folder' folder and lets other people download off him. Why am i saying this? Right, downloading something IS NOT ILLEGAL and i have a legitimate reason. That person is SHARING the file with other people. That is like me lending Jacen Aratan 'Rammstein'. That isn't illegal. Now where do you draw the line? 'File Sharing' becomes illegal when you start to SELL the material. Do you guys agree with me? _______________ - Even if Carlsberg made "w*nkers", Christiano Ronaldo would still be the biggest "w*nker" in the world |
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Do you think file sharing programs like Kazaa and Soul Seeker are illegal?
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(Jedi)Obi-JK - Student 
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Quote: Another problem, in my opinion, is that often, I like one or two songs by an artist - NOT his whole $20 CD, where I hate the other 16 songs. Wasnt this problem fixed? hint -> ( Itunes, MMJB, etc ) Then there are companies like Rhapsody, where you pay and you can stream entire CD's all freakin day ( you can also stream "singles" but unlike MMJB which is pretty much made to stram just the "hits" by artists, this is aim more for people who like to listen to a whole CD start to finish) I need to get rhapsody, Im at my cubicle for like 8 hours a day ( at least ) then on campus my laptop is always with me and mostly on, it think the service is only like $10/month _______________ Silent Bob (Kevin Smith): You know, there's a million fine looking women in the world, dude. But they don't all bring you lasagna at work. Most of 'em just cheat on you. -Steve (Obi) |
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Jacen Aratan - Student |
Quote: A good campaign against this may do the trick, as has been shown here in Belgium already. But this isn't the solution. We should make everyone realize that if you have the money for it, buy it! Or you can make companies go bankrupt, and yet again have people fired. You don't even have to make a company bankrupt to make them fire people. A good loss of a year is enough to fire people all around. I'm gonna go with e.g. Buzz here. It all sums up to one thing: the product is shitty. Do you really wanna spend $50 on a computer game where they've spent more money hyping it, than actually producing it? If more developers/movie producers/artists had quality in mind, rather than money, I feel pretty certain more would pay. And it's not like most publishers/others lose so much due to p2p that they have to declare bankruptcy. Rather, shitty reviews from newspapers or magazines will make people stay away from the game store/theatre. Another problem, in my opinion, is that often, I like one or two songs by an artist - NOT his whole $20 CD, where I hate the other 16 songs. |
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(Jedi)Obi-JK - Student
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Lets not forget that in both the Music industry AND the Video ( Theatre, DVD, TV, insert what ever I am forgetting ) Sales have went up proportioanlly with the number of who are using one of these P2P services. There was ONE, yes only ONE quarter where sales were down, but they down by like 1% whereas the next quarter they up like 5%. If I were a record exec, I would flood the mainstream P2P programs with "partial" copies of the lasest CD's there would be the small percentage of people who just got the "single" they wanted, but I gave up on file sharing because I just couldnt get an entire CD/Movie/TV show in perfect condition, but I did have like 50% of 27 things, and I really wanted the whole version, you can guess what I did. Then there are the Data Collection Companies, selling all the exec's information about what is being downloaded the most in one region, so they can flood that region with more items from that artist/genre/etc. _______________ Silent Bob (Kevin Smith): You know, there's a million fine looking women in the world, dude. But they don't all bring you lasagna at work. Most of 'em just cheat on you. -Steve (Obi) |
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Flux - Student 
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Quote: they invented CD-R drives so people could share and copy content. You dont need 700mb for a word document. Yes people do copy music onto cd's so they can listen to them on their own cd players but thats basiclly all the private use a cd-r gets. P2P programs are just like CD-R's but instead directly put on your computer. If people think P2P programs are illegal why doesnt someone stop the production of cd-writers? Feel free to critisise me  everyone always does... I hear that a lot sometimes when people get into discussing sharing and copying music. "Why not outlaw CD burners? They were made for the purpose of sharing". It is illegal to copy any music or media. That is the sole purpose of slapping a copyright label on a product. So nobody can make copies of it without the producer's permission. A copyright grants the producer exclusive rights to copy and distribute their own content. People may use CD-Rs to legally store raw data or backups other than music. It's just like tobacco pipes can't be outlawed because people use them to smoke crack. _______________ When great gentlemens come together in a place. It could happen. All these gentlemen are Howard's family. Everybody knows them, but nobody knows. Why they come together.......... Just play cards. |
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_cmad_ - Ex-Student 
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In reply to Bail: ... says the guy who downloaded software worth $3,000!  (or did you stop the download? )Well I don't really mind file-sharing... And I agree with Buzz. _______________ Your friends of today, are your enemies of tomorrow. |
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Ataris - Milwaukees Finest 
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File sharing clients like Kazaa, SLSK or DC++ are not illegal, the things you share can be illegal tho.. for example: almost every DC-hub (with a smart admin) clearly states that they're not responsible for any transfers of illegal stuff on their hub. this way they don't have to face charges for keeping the hub up, and giving people the chance to download from each other.. All theese p2p programs are legal because they're not done for downloading "warez".. if someone asks the persons resposible for releasing the DC++ network they can just simply reply that it's an file-exchange program for students across the world or something similar.. of course the non-official-idea was to download movies and stuff, but the law can't touch them on that point coz they "didn't plan it to be an warez-network".. This way DC++ isn't illegal in my eyes, feel free to comment..  _______________ [ Honorable mentions: aph3x | Milamber | Bail Hope Belouve | Jaiko D'Kana | Rosered | JediEthic | Mike/JJ/TheKing | Kensei | Dane | Gradius | Thomas Skywalker | Pink Floyd | Setementor | Steinin | Odan-Wei ] [ Owner of: MetaDust's 500th comment! | Eica's 700th comment! | Pink Floyd's 666th, 999th, 1200th and 1337th comment! | DarkRyu's 400th comment! | Redeye's 1st comment! | Cow's 1111st comment! | Rufusan's 75th comment! | Wicek's 3300th and 3400th comment! | Dash Starlight's 2000th comment! | Piccolo's 3400th comment! | Takaru's 300th comment! | Senor Hat's 900th comment! | Rytandus' 4160th comment! | The first ever awarded, the original, the one and only, Catphin Award!!1 ] "Music expresses that which can not be put in to words but can not remain silent." |
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Fate - Student 
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Ok, as far as legal/illegal, the issue is clear. It is illegal to share the intellectual property of another individual without prior consent. Ever notice the small print inside each cd case? It basically says you have bought a limited license to use the materials provided for personal use. Taking that information and creating a copy to provide to others is illegal. You might say "But I'm not giving it to them, they took it from me". But the "Digital Millenium Copyright Act" and every state regards failure to properly ensure the prevention of proliferation of copyrighted materials is a copyright infringement. Legally you ain't got a leg to stand on. Now I think you should have phrased this as "morally". Do I morally support software/music piracy? Yes. Why? Because the level of inflation, the lack of proper customer assurance and the lack of quality product being produced in general today warrants that we the users be compensated. A quick example: I bought an Airport base station from Apple. It shorted out within 5 minutes of coming out of the box. I called Apple and asked them to replace it which they said they would. They then ask for a credit card number. I ask why and they say "We're going to bill you the amount of $1, and send you a replacement. You then send us the old one and if we recieve it we will refund the $1. If not we will charge you $346." "But the Airport itself only costs $120... why does the replacement cost almost 3 times as much if I don't return the old one?" "Restocking fees". So, if I wanted the old Airport and the new one I'd have paid $460 for two devices retailed at 240.... that makes a lot of sense. If it truely cost them that much to restock they'd never make money. Companies need to learn that if they step on consumers, consumers are going to not feel very bad when they find a cheaper way to do things and leave those companies in the dust. Now I know Apple makes hardware, but don't expect me to buy any of their software either. _______________ I must not fear . Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear . I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain. Gom gom gom gom gom! |
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Mreoton - Student |
they invented CD-R drives so people could share and copy content. You dont need 700mb for a word document. Yes people do copy music onto cd's so they can listen to them on their own cd players but thats basiclly all the private use a cd-r gets. P2P programs are just like CD-R's but instead directly put on your computer. If people think P2P programs are illegal why doesnt someone stop the production of cd-writers? Feel free to critisise me everyone always does... |
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JamesF1 - Student 
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Anything I download having not paid for it (which is next to nothing as me ol' gal' [56k modem ] won't hold out ), I consider as an 'extended demo' I then go out and buy anything I like. _______________ Website |
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Steinin - Student 
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I would be happy if the money I paid at the cinema actually went to the people who created the film. Most just go into a few people's stuffed pockets who didn't do a squat for the movie. _______________ 362 Ohi on! |
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Bail Hope of Belouve - Student 
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Quote: I think the P2P system itself isn't illegal. The sharing of content is, though - and yes, even lending your own DVD out to the local bar to show it to the customers is illegal.  I know. That of course sounds dumb... to everyone... but there is logic behind that. Let's say we live in Shakersville, population of 20. There is this cool movie, "I am Rabbit" and it's out on DVD. Bob Tan owns, like everyone in the village, a DVD-player. He buys the movie, and then passes on the DVD to everyone in the village. The DVD-company only has 1/20 of the profit they should have. Imagine something like this going on in New York. For every 20 people, there is only one that buys it, and then passes it on, be it through Kazaa or through friends. Imagine their money dropping like hell. A good campaign against this may do the trick, as has been shown here in Belgium already. But this isn't the solution. We should make everyone realize that if you have the money for it, buy it! Or you can make companies go bankrupt, and yet again have people fired. You don't even have to make a company bankrupt to make them fire people. A good loss of a year is enough to fire people all around. In stead about everyone's bitching about they're out of a job, try actually spending money so those companies can grow and thus hire more people. This may be a long-term solution. It will not eradicate all unemployment, but every person who has a job is a person of the street. _______________ Visit the Belouve Family Website! Quote: I try to have fun with my friends and try to make a difference as best I can. What does making a difference mean? Well, it can be as simple as saying hello, answering a question that seems obvious or heck, just talking. -- Vladarion
Want to know Vladarion? Read the Article about his life here. |
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Mookie - Ex-Student 
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I think the P2P system itself isn't illegal. The sharing of content is, though - and yes, even lending your own DVD out to the local bar to show it to the customers is illegal. |
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Steinin - Student 
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Nice topic. I found this last week and decided to "share" it with you. http://www.corante.com/importance/archives/005537.php _______________ 362 Ohi on! |
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Carve - Student 
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If it weren't for filesharing, none of you would know me! Isn't that justification enough? _______________ © |
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Buzz - Student 
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If you're concerned about the artists not getting their money and need to sell their 15 million dollar beach houses and just live in their 150 million dollar regular homes, then I would suggest going to their concerts and buying their merchandise, since that is where the artists make the most of their money. There have also been a few studies by major universities in the US that have said the reason the music industry is losing money is not because of free music sharing programs. Their problem is that their products are crap and they're asking a price that people don't want to pay because they dont' think the product is worth the money they're asking for. Compare this to DVD's. People are willing to pay more money for them because they feel that they're getting their money's worth for the product. The music companies wouldn't be getting my money if file sharing of mp3's became illegal. I don't use it as a substitute to buying the CD's. _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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Jello` - Student 
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I think sharing files is perfectly fine, but when you get money and selling them involved, it crosses the line. Like Monty says, I download to use as a 'rental service' with most of my CDs. I wont waste $15 EFFING DOLLARS these days (rediculous) to buy a CD and come home and find out it absolutely BLOWS. _______________ Brady Brothers: Orion-Greg, Furi0us-Peter, Me-Bobby. Long lost cousin to Flash. Midbie Council #007. Ex-JAK. |
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Monteeeeeee - Nugget 
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Most people seem to think im a the Warez King, basically i think of sharing programs as a free video/game rental. If i like the game i will actually buy it. thats the truth, like atm im playing Sudeki which i downloaded, now i love it, so im gonna buy it when its out over here, i downloaded the Import version, Now wot drives most people to download stuff such as Movies/Games, the main reason for me, Hyped up Previews over here only to find it isnt out for another 3 months but wait its out in USA. so hmmmm should i wait 3 months and loose intrest or should i download a copy just so i know what its like? i let u decide which is best. Same goes for Movies, i had to download Man on Fire, which is a new Denzel Washington Movie, because it isnt out here till October, altho it was out in USA in april. I think one way to cut it down a little is to have INTERNATIONAL release dates for such things, FF online isnt even out over here yet, now developers cant bullshit me about it isnt ready yet, its out in USA and has been for quite a long time. See me point? if u dont then dont worry, its my views on this subject. But if u do like it and u wanna see a sequel then buy it or it wont happen _______________ If you add me to MSN, tell me who you are
Best Movie Character EVER!! |
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CuZzA - Student 
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yeah but 99.9% of the time its not illigal downloaded material, just some other guy who has downloaded legal material and changed the name _______________ - Even if Carlsberg made "w*nkers", Christiano Ronaldo would still be the biggest "w*nker" in the world This comment was edited by CuZzA on Aug 16 2004 10:05pm. |
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Flux - Student 
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I think it's entirely illegal. When a person downloads a song or movie, they are downloading illegally copied material without paying for it. It's stealing and it's against the law. Same goes for sharing. But you're right. The software itself is not illegal. The users are responsible for what they share and download. I myself do download movies and music (but really, who doesn't?). I'm aware that it is illegal and that I do have a chance of getting caught. I'll just be responsible for my actions in the small chance that it ever comes to that. _______________ When great gentlemens come together in a place. It could happen. All these gentlemen are Howard's family. Everybody knows them, but nobody knows. Why they come together.......... Just play cards. |
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Charly - Student 
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I completely agree with you Cuzza |
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Bail Hope of Belouve - Student
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I don't agree with you one bit When thinking about the aspect of 'sharing' you are correct. The Music business is not sharing. It's buying. If no one would buy Metallica's cd's, they would stop playing. If they can't make enough money to make a 2nd cd (I believe there is a minimal limit, because I've read about something like that) they'll stop producing stuff and just call it off. Sure, it's completely different when you share something. Like: "Oh yeah, that movie you made is cool, and THIS file would go great as a soundtrack" When you pass the file on to him then, then I think it's just sharing. It's even more illegal when you sell them. But the topic of Kazaa, Napster, Limewire, etc, is something special. You see, they don't offer you software to download illegal stuff. They give you a p2p (peer 2 peer) network, that allows you to share stuff. In their disclaimers they say that they are not responsible for what is shared. For instance, when I have something I made myself, and I want to share it with a friend of mine, but I can't stay online, I can put it up on Kazaa. He can search for it, and download it straight off my computer. That people use this for mp3's, movies, etc, is not their fault, and they can't be sued because this happens. _______________ Visit the Belouve Family Website! Quote: I try to have fun with my friends and try to make a difference as best I can. What does making a difference mean? Well, it can be as simple as saying hello, answering a question that seems obvious or heck, just talking. -- Vladarion
Want to know Vladarion? Read the Article about his life here. |
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