| Animal Intelligence | |
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Ashyr - Student  |
Due to a past thread, I was inspired to start a discussion on whether you guys think other animals are as intelligent or more intelligent that us. Some people say that say, dolphins, apes, ect are as smart if not smarter than humans. Discuss. _______________ Top ten reasons to get a better computer...|My fan |
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Ashyr - Student 
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Quote: Animals do have "wars" actually. Haven't you ever watched the Discovery Channel documentaries where you see a group of monkeys living peacefully and then another group comes along and tries to push them out of their territory. Wouldn't you consider that to be a war? I wouldn't doubt it happening in other animals as well where there is a pack mentality to their organization there will be conflict. Yeah, but that's more like a gang fight, which technically, is a war on a small scale.  PS: lol DM _______________ Top ten reasons to get a better computer...|My fan |
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Masta - Jedi Council 
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Lets hunt them all down!!!!11 _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. This comment was edited by Masta on Dec 15 2004 12:43am. |
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Plo Koon - Student 
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Yes those damn elephants are so damaging to the environment! spewing chemicals and poisans into the eco- system! Darn elephants! _______________ Free Tibet! Click this link,and learn Here too |
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Flamori Athena - Student 
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So it's true that we are the only animal conciously helping the enviroment, never mind that it's most damage we ourselves inflicted...because after all, the elephants would raze the forests too if they had a chance, right? the difference being that they cant, not that they wouldnt...so why are we the only ones who can? _______________ «±» 21st on the Midbie Council, Profile ID: 2027 «±» True wisdom is the knowledge that you know nothing. |
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Flamori Athena - Student 
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The turkey...the only animal smarter than man...what the hell is that? *gobble gobble* It's a turkey! Die, turkey!! _______________ «±» 21st on the Midbie Council, Profile ID: 2027 «±» True wisdom is the knowledge that you know nothing. |
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Buzz - Student 
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Animals do have "wars" actually. Haven't you ever watched the Discovery Channel documentaries where you see a group of monkeys living peacefully and then another group comes along and tries to push them out of their territory. Wouldn't you consider that to be a war? I wouldn't doubt it happening in other animals as well where there is a pack mentality to their organization there will be conflict. _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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DaRtH-MoBiLiTy - Student 
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I still say Goats Pwn Us  -DM- _______________ One Day, it will all end. |
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JavaGuy - Student 
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Uh no. As I've already pointed out, we're the only animal that makes a conscious effort to preserve the environment. We are not the only animal that sometimes damages the environment. Don't see many elephants chaining themselves to trees to protest the way the rest of the herd is deforesting the region, but you do see elephants deforesting huge regions. And animals certainly do know greed, envy, anger. Anybody who has worked with dogs for any amount of time knows this. I also point out that in a confrontation between two human males, 99.9% of the time nobody gets hurt--though like dogs with their raised hackles and snarling, there are often angry words and maybe even a shove. Animals do not make war, but I do not think this is because they are wiser. Edmund Contoski describes war in his classic Makers and Takers as a highly organized form of theft. To bolster his argument he notes the archeological evidence for when war first happened: When there was something to steal.  Prior to the discovery of agriculture, humans had pretty much nothing in the way of surplus material wealth, so it made no sense for a large group of people to organize an assault to steal when there was nothing to steal, or at least not enough to go around when the invaders divided the loot. After the discovery of agriculture, suddenly there was actually surplus food, and people had free time to make other things too. Immediately after the discovery of agriculture came the first wars. So while animals do not make war, it is not because they are too wise to make war but because they are not wise enough to have discovered agriculture. _______________ My signature is only one line. You're welcome. |
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Phantom - Student 
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I think that the tecnolegy way, we are smarter but in the whole killing the planet they do a better job at preseving it. _______________ -Phantom Ex-Master to Threat. Proud owner of Sazabi's 1500th comment! And Threats 50th comment "Insanity: a perfect rational adjustment to an insane world" |
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Ashyr - Student 
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Quote: 2.) But then why do we do so many STUPID things. The answer to this has been discussed in posts below. _______________ Top ten reasons to get a better computer...|My fan |
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(Jedi)Obi-JK - Student 
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I think the real point here I would make is. 1.) We are definitely MORE intellegent 2.) But then why do we do so many STUPID things. My dog doesnt worry about going to war. If two animals fight to be the Alpha male 99% of the time they do it in a way where neaither will really get hurt. While they are not as smart they also dont posses our faults. Greed Envy Etc _______________ Silent Bob (Kevin Smith): You know, there's a million fine looking women in the world, dude. But they don't all bring you lasagna at work. Most of 'em just cheat on you. -Steve (Obi) |
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Ashyr - Student
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Quote: /me thinks Goats are the most intelligent of all God's Creatures. -DM- I got it. _______________ Top ten reasons to get a better computer...|My fan |
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DaRtH-MoBiLiTy - Student
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/me Throws Frozen Water on the Polar ice caps to protect them.... oh and Goats Still pwn us..... -DM- _______________ One Day, it will all end. |
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JavaGuy - Student
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I think the "destroying the environment" hysteria is silly. Yes, Man sometimes pollutes. Objective measures show that pollution is not nearly as bad today as it was a hundred years ago, despite huge population growth and the fact the industry has grown by leaps and bounds. There are seven animals that use tools. There is only one anaimal that has ever made a conscious effort protect the environment: Man. I don't see elephants, which are extremely destructive to the environment and deforest whole regions, passing laws to limit or regulate deforestation, nor do I see them forming nonprofit organizations to protect forests. I do see lots of humans doing these things. Give the environmental hysteria a rest. We are not the first creature to affect our environment. We ARE the first species to save species that would have gone extinct without our help. _______________ My signature is only one line. You're welcome. |
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Ashyr - Student
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Quote: They'd destroy their environment just like people do if they had the ability. That's exactly what I was trying to say by this: Quote: Intelligence is a completely different matter than wisdom. We are more intelligent, yet probobly just as wise as they are. They follow their instincts, naturally protect themselves, and do whatever they are impulsed to do (within the lines of the first two). We do the same. As we can most likely conclude, these may not always be the wisest choices in a given situation(except maybe #2). This shows a similarity in wisdom. So, the question, if they act just as foolishly as we do, why are they keeping things balanced while we destroy things? Our intelligence. Our intelligence is the thing that puts us on the top of the food chain, and gives us power. It gives us the ability to radically change things. This power, combined with the foolishness, creates the destruction. Animals are not as intellegent, and are not the dominant species. Therefore they do not have the ability to change things so radically. So their foolishness can only destroy things on a small level, and this is also controlled by us—the dominant species. That is why they stand idly by as we destroy things. So, my conclusion, if animals were as smart as us, they would do the same thing. I hope that puts things into perspective. _______________ Top ten reasons to get a better computer...|My fan |
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Buzz - Student
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Quote: who can tell that animals are WAY WAY more intelligent than we are ? at least they live in balance with their environment and watch us dooming ourselves. We are dumb! I'll submit that animals don't live in balance with nature. Nature balances itself out. Let's take the simple system of plants rabbits and wolves. Nature has it balanced so there are enough plants for the rabbits to eat and for the plants to continue surviving. There are also enough rabbits so the wolves can eat and the rabbits continue to survive. The wolves are the final balancer, their eating of the rabbits makes sure the plants continue on. Now say something comes along that makes the wolf population decrease. Now there aren't as many wolves to eat the rabbits. The rabbit population thrives because they don't know the system is no longer in balance and there shouldn't be that many of them. The increase in rabbits means more plants are eaten and now there aren't enough plants for the rabbits. So now the rabbits start dying of starvation. Eventually a point will be reached where enough rabbits die so a new equilibrium is restored. But not because the wolves and rabbits know they're living in balance with their environment, but because the environment balances itself. They'd destroy their environment just like people do if they had the ability. _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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JavaGuy - Student 
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Bees build hives, which are rather extraordinary. But a bee builds a hive because it is genetically hard-wired to do so, specialized through hundreds of millions of years of natural selection. A bee's "mind" understands what it is building only slightly better than a hammer understands that it is falling when you drop it...and has about as much choice in the matter. Let's do a thought experiment. Take any species of bee from one climate and put it in a different climate. Take some humans from one climate and put them in a different climate. Watch what kind of shelter they build for themselves: The humans think it over, look around at the materials available to them, and use their imaginations to envision the different kinds of shelters they could build. Then they use reason to decide which of the those things might really work as well in the real world as in their imaginations. After narrowing down the imaginary choices to a handful of ones that are really possible to build with the available materials, they again use their imaginations and the power of reason to try to decide the various costs and benefits of building each one: Is this really going to keep me warm and dry? Will it fall apart more easily than a different shelter I might build? Even if it is the best of my options, will it take so long to build that I'll freeze to death before I get it finished? Should I perhaps build an easier shelter first and then worry about a better one later? The bees build exactly the kind of hive that they are hard-wired to build. They have no concept of whether it will be appropriate to the climate. If materials like what they are accustomed to building with are not available, they are out of luck, unlike the humans who, deprived of abundant lumber, for example, might build with mud bricks, or figure out something else ingenious. Quote: Many animals make homes, and on the rare occasion they use sticks and miscelaneous (completely spelled wrong, and I'm too lazy to look it up) things to reach objects, ect. Yes. If I recall correctly from biology class, there are seven animals in the world that use tools. The only ones I remember are Man, the sea otter, and some kind of ape that uses sticks to fish ants out of ant hills to eat them. This later is interesting because researchers first thought this was a simple task...and then discovered that they themselves could not do it. Turns out it takes a lot of practice to learn. Then they thought that the apes could just do it instinctively, like bees making hives, but no, baby apes raised in captivity can't do it. They learn it from their parents, which means it's a kind of culture, something passed on through teaching from one generation to the next. Not Hamlet, no, but very cool._______________ My signature is only one line. You're welcome. This comment was edited by JavaGuy on Dec 04 2004 01:56am. |
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Ashyr - Student
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Quote:
Quote: 2. They don't make homes, tools to make their lives easier, ect. Many animals make homes, bird's nests, beaver dam's, etc. And I'm pretty sure some gorillas use tools. Forgive me, I didn't really think that out very well, you're right. Many animals make homes, and on the rare occasion they use sticks and miscelaneous (completely spelled wrong, and I'm too lazy to look it up) things to reach objects, ect. _______________ Top ten reasons to get a better computer...|My fan |
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Jacen Aratan - Student |
Depends on what humans we're talking about. I mean, if it's Flash, the coolest dude around.... |
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Flash - Student 
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Smarter than humans? Uhh, I'd have to disagree, I don't see any animals building and inventing all of the things we are... |
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(Jedi)Obi-JK - Student
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I would say dogs (because I have the most experience with dealing with them) show fairly high intelegence. Now we are the species that teaches them to communicate with us, but they do learn to communicate. 1.) Almost every dog in the world will stand by a door of the house, and either paw at it, bark, wimper, or do something. And I think that dogs do actually learn from this. My parents dog, will now sit by its food bag and bark (not like a mean or evern a loud bark) if it is hungry and someone forgot to feed it. Bascially the dog figured out on its own that it can do what it does when it needs to learn use the rest room (backyard) in multiple instances and that will let its care takers know it needs something, not just a specific thing. On another note, I would say dogs maybe smarter than humans, they get all thier meals paid for them, and served to them, they get a pat on the head for not pooping in the house, and someone else cleans up after them when they are done with thier business, sounds like the good life to me! _______________ Silent Bob (Kevin Smith): You know, there's a million fine looking women in the world, dude. But they don't all bring you lasagna at work. Most of 'em just cheat on you. -Steve (Obi) |
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DaRtH-MoBiLiTy - Student 
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/me thinks Goats are the most intelligent of all God's Creatures. -DM- _______________ One Day, it will all end. |
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Bail Hope of Belouve - Student 
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Quote: 2. They don't make homes, tools to make their lives easier, ect. oh yeah, especially those birds who make their own nest _______________ Visit the Belouve Family Website! Quote: I try to have fun with my friends and try to make a difference as best I can. What does making a difference mean? Well, it can be as simple as saying hello, answering a question that seems obvious or heck, just talking. -- Vladarion
Want to know Vladarion? Read the Article about his life here. |
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Proximo - Student 
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Quote: 2. They don't make homes, tools to make their lives easier, ect. Many animals make homes, bird's nests, beaver dam's, etc. And I'm pretty sure some gorillas use tools. _______________ Gladiators, I salute you. |
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Trelane - Student 
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A while back on TV there was a show about a scientist in BC (canada) who was studying Killer Whales, and their language. She noticed that whenever a whale would return to the pod (after being away a while eating fishish or whatever) members of the pod would make a specific noise..kinda like "whaaaa" So one day she say a big bull whale come up for air and as he passed her boat she shouted "WHAAAA". He stopped, popped his head out of the water (as if to say "huh?" , looked at her and returned the greeting before ducking back under water.She told another story about getting lost in some nasty nasty fog. A really bad thing considering she was only in a little 12 ft. boat. She lost land, and had no idea where she was. The pod she had been studying circled her boat, and through a little coersion led her safely back to shore. Just a couple of examples of whales demonstrating higher intelligence I suppose. Namely language skills and advanced reasoning. |
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