| Who is the Best Saberist in History ? | |
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Ian Jandos - Student  |
I suppose there is not a clear cut answer to this. However, I'd like to see what opinions are out there. Obi-Wan and Anakin seemed to be an equal match, perhaps Anakin on flat ground might be better...but considering he lost his cool, perhaps that would happen in a different scenario as well. Dooku, a viable contender, but if Anakin could beat him, then he obviously doesn't rank at the top. Additionally, Palpatine, who diced several Jedi quickly could not dispatch Windu, even with force aiding him. Yoda, who held his own with Palpatine and Dooku did not demonstrate onscreen at least, the ability to land any blows. Whereas Windu was able to win his duel w/Palpatine. Then there are wild cards such as Darth Maul, Qui-Gon, and Luke Skywalker. Maul obviously was very talented, but did not prove he could overpower a youthful Obi-Wan with his saber alone. I wouldn't necessarily give Obi-Wan the advantage, but that brings up enough doubt for me to rank Maul out of contention. Qui-Gon-Jinn, obviously since he died, that kind of takes him down a notch as well. Luke, I would consider to be in the same boat as his father, with the exception that his lack of formal training would probably give him less rank. Sure he bested his father, but that victory came over a simply less capable saberist due to Vader's reliance of robotic limbs. Luke's "win" only came through rage more than say his control. Having said all of that, my vote is for Mace Windu. A solid, polished saberist, who should have been the one that ended the Sith. -Ian _______________ Member #7625 | Since 7.6.04 The Archives This post was edited by Ian Jandos on Jul 22 2005 10:13pm. |
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Who is the Best Saberist in History?
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Stig - Student 
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Mace Windu uses Vaapad and he is the only Jedi to use it _______________ Proud Padawan of Setementor -Saber good, Pistol Bad- Owner of DarthMike's 200th Comment, My paddy brother Grycen's 100th Comment, Raydoe_Mintaka's 347th Comment, TheDestroyer's 615th Comment, Jedifire_Mintaka's 66th Comment and My cool master Setementor's 7500th Comment!!! (Offer me more everybody!!!) |
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Vasper Ba'xian - Student 
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Aye good points.. I believe Maul's power came in part from his intimidation factor. He was a very skilled duelist. But in the Jedi's firt encounter with him, he came right out and attacked a Jedi Master without hesitation. That and cmon, how many Jedi have fought a Sith b4 let alone one with a STAFF! Nah Maul could not of taken the Jedi. He was Palpatine's version of Jet Li in his new movie, "unleashed" Trained to be a fierce animal and folow orders. Windu woulda laughed at em! _______________ Brother to: Tamal, Kavar, J.D.,Jermia, Devlin, Ulic, Xiabara, Seij,Tarron Mib,>>>ROCK ON  .My Spacescapes art page.My Everything Else art page. MY FAV. Jedi Are: Qui-Gon Jinn, Corran Horn, and Anakin Solo. Unofficial Master to Tamal. and Kavar. Founder of the Wuji Hundun Jian saber style. Proud owner of Tamal's 200th comment!//Proud owner of Refl3x's 300th comment!>>>Proud owner of Tyrant's 800th comment>>>Proud owner of Lucky's 170th comment>>>Proud owner of BDKawika's 444th comment>>>To except Existance is to except Reality.
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Ecks - Student 
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So you're saying Maul is stronger than Yoda? Maul wasn't THAT powerful, his staff gave him an advantage over Qui-Gon. Granted, he was a skilled, very good martial artist, but as you can see, when Obi-Wan cut his saber in half, he was hard pressed against Obi's onslaught, and had to rely on Force-Push to disable Obi. _______________ "To become a greater man, you must be a lesser one first." |
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Phantom - Student 
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No this is all a what if he had killed Obi-wan in eposide one and then he wouldnt need to kill him in eposide 3. And no I dont read the books or go searching online for this stuff. Im not that into it. _______________ -Phantom Ex-Master to Threat. Proud owner of Sazabi's 1500th comment! And Threats 50th comment "Insanity: a perfect rational adjustment to an insane world" This comment was edited by Phantom on Jul 25 2005 12:11pm. |
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Nuebus - Student 
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Quote: Maul is the strongest because even though we only got to see a inch of his power in the first moive. He only died because he didnt do his job as a sith, he didnt kill Obi when he had the chance. And think of it like this, Anikin couldnt beat Obi-wan and in my veiw of eposide one maul beat obi-wan even though he had died. And eventually Maul would have killed Palpatine since thats the sith way. And from their he could have possiably went on to destroy the Jedi inculding Mace and Yoda. And Yes I know this is all a what if thing but this is the way I like to veiw it. dude.. have u watche dthe movies or read the books? maul would not have gone on 2 destroy the jedi or palp, maul may have been a good duellist by his intelligence was limited. as they said he was an animal. if palp had that same intelligence he'd have been uncovered, trialed and judged long ago. maul would have either gone straight for the jedi after obi's death where he would have been killed by the sheer numbers without the clone troopers 2 back him up. if he went for palpatine he'd get carved up, palp took down 3 jedi knights easy without breaking a sweat. In maul's case, was not all that force sensitive either because he only showed his force ability 3 times during his duel against qui gon/obi wan, where as palpatine had a mastery of the forceand would have taken down maul as easily as kit fisto and the other jedis he killed. forgive me if i misinterpretted ur post but u seem 2 imply that ep 1 maul could defeat ep 3 obi wan. i believe u've been misled due 2 the fact in ep 1 Obi wan was learning his master's form, Form 4, Ataru which he had not mastered like qui gon even tho qui gon lost. then the fact ep 2 and 3 obi wan used Soresu, form 3 in combat. Soresu may b a known defensive style but Maul used his personalized form of the incompleted Juyo which may still have been defeated by Soresu... then again we'll never know. so basically even tho maul tecnically defeated obi he would not have gone onfor any other greatness if he survived because he has the instincts of an animal and primarily IS an animal. _______________ Sanity is for the weak -Let the madness consume you... I'ma moron, i'm the master of morons, i even got a club of morons... so how do u beat me at bein a moron?... and no, not by being u. Ex-Padawan of Chaos~ This comment was edited by Nuebus on Jul 25 2005 07:32am. |
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Phantom - Student
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Maul is the strongest because even though we only got to see a inch of his power in the first moive. He only died because he didnt do his job as a sith, he didnt kill Obi when he had the chance. And think of it like this, Anikin couldnt beat Obi-wan and in my veiw of eposide one maul beat obi-wan even though he had died. And eventually Maul would have killed Palpatine since thats the sith way. And from their he could have possiably went on to destroy the Jedi inculding Mace and Yoda. And Yes I know this is all a what if thing but this is the way I like to veiw it. _______________ -Phantom Ex-Master to Threat. Proud owner of Sazabi's 1500th comment! And Threats 50th comment "Insanity: a perfect rational adjustment to an insane world" |
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Ecks - Student
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To Limana: Just because it's a fight for your life doesn't make a move not "cheap." No one will blame you for using it, and it was absolutely necessary to use the cheap move, but the fact stands, that a cheap move is still a cheap move. And Maul wasn't naturally strong, he was trained to be that strong; a Jedi killer. When you are focused into the hate machine that Sidious made him into, you pack a pretty good punch.  _______________ "To become a greater man, you must be a lesser one first." |
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SaZ - Student 
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Quote:
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Quote: Dath maul was a very good duelist tho. He is a Zabrak. And they are about 3 times as strong as a normal human. How do you know that Zabrak are 3 times as strong as humans? Their physique is quite similar to that of humans, so this doesn't seem plausible to me. :s there not. they have a higher tolerance to pain than humans, becuase of genetics. they are Slightly stronger. not much though. i bet that robe covers his uberbig muscles lol _______________ playing jk3 since 30th of january (2005), member since 1st of february. [Unofficial Master to Vision and Z�diac ] If you can make a fool of yourself infront of 300 people you can do anything - Jaiko D'kana |
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NotSoLittleCaesar - Student 
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Quote:
Quote: Dath maul was a very good duelist tho. He is a Zabrak. And they are about 3 times as strong as a normal human. How do you know that Zabrak are 3 times as strong as humans? Their physique is quite similar to that of humans, so this doesn't seem plausible to me. :s there not. they have a higher tolerance to pain than humans, becuase of genetics. they are Slightly stronger. not much though. _______________ Quote: I mostly agree oh Lord of the squeezy mop
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Thomasooo - Student 
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Quote: Dath maul was a very good duelist tho. He is a Zabrak. And they are about 3 times as strong as a normal human. How do you know that Zabrak are 3 times as strong as humans? Their physique is quite similar to that of humans, so this doesn't seem plausible to me. :s _______________ In the navy and LOVING it! 
Recipient of comment no. 1000 and heart-warming words from Ataris!
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Limana D'Kana - Student 
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OK, We will never know who was the best duelist ever. These movies is a timeline of about 50 years or something. There was jedi's like 10000 years ago to. There might been much better jedi's than Yoda, Palapatine. Some were strong in force, some were strong in duels. I dont think there is any cheap ways to fight, Would you guys not do anything "cheap" to save yourself from death? Yes you would. I dont think any of these characters are better than the other ones. Much is about if you make any mistakes. If you make 1 mistake like Darth Maul did. You will die. Dath maul was a very good duelist tho. He is a Zabrak. And they are about 3 times as strong as a normal human. Thats why he could knock Qui-gon so he was left open. Count Dooku was a good duelist. He had much skill, but his body was not strong enough. Yoda was quick and fast. But pretty much to old for it. Still a very good fighter. Anakin, Very skilled and strong, but to aggresive. Young Obi. Good skilled, not very strong. He was smart but not very good at resisting force. Mace Windu. Dont know very much about him... Palapatine. He would be the best one at the list i think. He uses the force and the saber to defeat his opponent. He was very strong in the force, and very skilled. Srry for the bad english, and i hope you dont hate me to much after this message. _______________ c",) c",) c",) c",) c",) c",) c",) c",) |
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Ecks - Student 
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Quote: Well, Yoda had to deal with Palpatine's force, but so did Windu, and he was able to repel the lightning. Palp. was also probably keyed up a bit more, since he knew the Jedi were going to come for him. Hard to say...but I don't see Yoda being better...in force however, a definite yes. In regard to Maul, he was Palp's apprentice, so I'm assuming he was trained by him. Who else could do it? -Ian Windu used his saber to deflect the lightning. Yoda would have been able to beat Palpatine, but Palps managed to shoot Yoda's lightsaber out of his hand. So, now Yoda lacks an offensive weapon, so it'd be impossible for him to defeat Palpatine now anyway. But good point. _______________ "To become a greater man, you must be a lesser one first." |
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Vasper Ba'xian - Student 
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Tulak Horrd was a Sith Lord. In a time when Jedi and Sith were near equal numbers. Lightsaber vs Lightsaberwas VERY common in his time. I think it was more Sith vs Sith in Tulaks time though. _______________ Brother to: Tamal, Kavar, J.D.,Jermia, Devlin, Ulic, Xiabara, Seij,Tarron Mib,>>>ROCK ON .My Spacescapes art page.My Everything Else art page. MY FAV. Jedi Are: Qui-Gon Jinn, Corran Horn, and Anakin Solo. Unofficial Master to Tamal. and Kavar. Founder of the Wuji Hundun Jian saber style. Proud owner of Tamal's 200th comment!//Proud owner of Refl3x's 300th comment!>>>Proud owner of Tyrant's 800th comment>>>Proud owner of Lucky's 170th comment>>>Proud owner of BDKawika's 444th comment>>>To except Existance is to except Reality.
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solitude - Jedi Council 
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Quote: Tulak Horrd who? _______________ Joined 16 October 2004 | Retired 10 April 2005 | Returned 05 June 2008 | Made Staff 27 June 2008 | Made Council 18 January 2009 Padawan To Odan-Wei Belouve | Adopted into the Belouve family | Twin to xAnAtOs | Owner of the 4th Quesi sexy badge Brother To Roan Belouve, Nomad, Majno, Silkmonkey, Kensei and Jarhok Belouve
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Ian Jandos - Student 
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Well, Yoda had to deal with Palpatine's force, but so did Windu, and he was able to repel the lightning. Palp. was also probably keyed up a bit more, since he knew the Jedi were going to come for him. Hard to say...but I don't see Yoda being better...in force however, a definite yes. In regard to Maul, he was Palp's apprentice, so I'm assuming he was trained by him. Who else could do it? -Ian _______________ Member #7625 | Since 7.6.04 The Archives |
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Ecks - Student
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But of course, duels are almost never fair, and you have to be ready for any situation. So in terms of wins-losses, Windu is the "best", having defeated or survived all the opponents he fought. He did NOT lose to Palpatine, it was that git Anakin's interference that killed Windu. And Talion said it better than I ever could. Maul was a beast, and was taught to enjoy the kill, which led to his eventual death. _______________ "To become a greater man, you must be a lesser one first." |
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NotSoLittleCaesar - Student
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well. mace windu IS the second best saberist of the council. yoda IS better. he simpyl isnt seen fighting opponents on fair grounds. (a senate room..?) maul was IMO the best, he beat both a apdawan and master. he simply is a beast. taught to enjoy th kill...thats what led him to his death, _______________ Quote: I mostly agree oh Lord of the squeezy mop
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Ecks - Student
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I think that was just how he fought. He wasn't necessarily the best duelist, in fact, he could only beat Obi-Wan using the Force. I believe he was actually pretty uptight in the fight, his entire focus was into the duel, but when things were not going his way, he would taunt his opponent to make them less confident. So, he just gave the illusion that he was toying with his opponent to shatter their will. _______________ "To become a greater man, you must be a lesser one first." |
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Vasper Ba'xian - Student
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One thing I do have to admit is that Dooku could have been MUCH more fierce. If we wasn't always trying to toy with people and put his full attention on the fight and his anger, he'd be bad a$$! _______________ Brother to: Tamal, Kavar, J.D.,Jermia, Devlin, Ulic, Xiabara, Seij,Tarron Mib,>>>ROCK ON .My Spacescapes art page.My Everything Else art page. MY FAV. Jedi Are: Qui-Gon Jinn, Corran Horn, and Anakin Solo. Unofficial Master to Tamal. and Kavar. Founder of the Wuji Hundun Jian saber style. Proud owner of Tamal's 200th comment!//Proud owner of Refl3x's 300th comment!>>>Proud owner of Tyrant's 800th comment>>>Proud owner of Lucky's 170th comment>>>Proud owner of BDKawika's 444th comment>>>To except Existance is to except Reality.
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Mikouen - Student 
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i vote Yoda, his show of agility and stamina in both movies was awesome. but the others all did some darn good duelin too. i'd pick all of 'em (well, except Maul lol) |
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Ecks - Student
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But again, there was no actual proof that Yoda is weaker than Mace. Yoda is not as weak as you think he is. As much as Lucas f'ed up the fight against Sidious, Yoda essentially was the better saberist in that fight. Palps had to resort to Force Powers to stave off Yoda's onslaught of Ataru. I would still place my money on Yoda in ANY fight, but you're entitled to your opinion. _______________ "To become a greater man, you must be a lesser one first." |
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Nuebus - Student 
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2 was meant for to* my mistake _______________ Sanity is for the weak -Let the madness consume you... I'ma moron, i'm the master of morons, i even got a club of morons... so how do u beat me at bein a moron?... and no, not by being u. Ex-Padawan of Chaos~ |
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Vasper Ba'xian - Student
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Quote: Yoda used his form 2 make up for his short reach, as a human backe dup with the completion of Juyo and his longer reach he'd probable beat Yoda in a saber fight but not in force. Actually Yoda was a Form IV user. The aerobatic version of Form II _______________ Brother to: Tamal, Kavar, J.D.,Jermia, Devlin, Ulic, Xiabara, Seij,Tarron Mib,>>>ROCK ON .My Spacescapes art page.My Everything Else art page. MY FAV. Jedi Are: Qui-Gon Jinn, Corran Horn, and Anakin Solo. Unofficial Master to Tamal. and Kavar. Founder of the Wuji Hundun Jian saber style. Proud owner of Tamal's 200th comment!//Proud owner of Refl3x's 300th comment!>>>Proud owner of Tyrant's 800th comment>>>Proud owner of Lucky's 170th comment>>>Proud owner of BDKawika's 444th comment>>>To except Existance is to except Reality.
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Nuebus - Student
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on the basis that Mace WIndu completed the Juyo form (Vaapad). a form that only he succeeded in using without falling to teh dark side. In any saber combat alone Juyo form would probably beat any other style down. i mean look at maul, he used his own personal form of Juyo and he beat Obiwan and qui gon, if he didnt show off he woulda have lived and obi would have died. the offensive form of vaapad was by far more unpreditable then Ataru or Makashi both forms designed to combat single opponents in close combat. its unpredictability was its strength. Yoda used his form to make up for his short reach, as a human backe dup with the completion of Juyo and his longer reach he'd probable beat Yoda in a saber fight but not in force. against Obi Wan he'd win due 2 teh defensive style Obi fights in, awaiting for a pattern 2 show so he strikes, which is exactly what Juyo's unpredictability counters. Dooku uses a modified form of Makashi designed for close combat. howveer its a 'formal' style, against Juyo i'd b like a guy with a butcher knife fighting a gfuy with a switch blade. Anakin uses a modified form of Shien, and again it would have the same results against Obi. Palpatine was old, and physically weak, in a saber duel Windu would prolly rip him apart. thats wat my basis is on. Vaapad was made 2 deal in the unusual situations, its 'absorbing' of the dark side only gave it more power. EDIT: and dooku and yoda in there primes would most likely b more skilled however they are NOT in there primes. so my money's still on mace. _______________ Sanity is for the weak -Let the madness consume you... I'ma moron, i'm the master of morons, i even got a club of morons... so how do u beat me at bein a moron?... and no, not by being u. Ex-Padawan of Chaos~ This comment was edited by Nuebus on Jul 24 2005 05:17am. |
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Ecks - Student
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Quote: so the definate best saberrist would definately be Mace. On what basis do you situate this argument? Just because Mace "defeated" Palpatine does not mean at all that he is the greatest duelist. Dooku and Yoda in their primes were probably more skilled than he. _______________ "To become a greater man, you must be a lesser one first." |
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