| BREAKING NEWS: V-TECH KILLER SENDS PACKAGE TO NBC | |
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CuZzA - Student  |
NBC has just recieved a package from The V-Tech mass murderer (Cho Seung-Hui). The package was believed to have been sent during the 2 and a half hour time gap between the first 2 killings and the other 30+.
Click Here _______________ - Even if Carlsberg made "w*nkers", Christiano Ronaldo would still be the biggest "w*nker" in the world |
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Virtue - Jedi Council 
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Kenwan, your first comment on this thread saw you taking a shot at Buzz, then patronizing pretty much everyone else who has posted in it (barring Menaxia and Lirael):
Quote: Buzz v1.0 (and co): Childish bickering at a place near YOU
Come on girls, keep it clean  Im not quite sure what you were trying to achieve with that, to be honest. You are in no position of authority here (and I'm not suggesting that you think you are or anything), so I'm assuiming that you were trying to joke around with the "Come on girls" bit - but in order for something like that to be funny, you have to know people pretty well and be friends with them for them to get it. As it stands, it just looked like you were trying to be spiteful and elevate yourself above everyone else. May not have been your intention, but that's how it came accross. Same with the "Come on children...and Buzz" comment. You are not more mature or intelligent than everyone else here, this is a fact. You are also a Student (at the JA), the same as almost everyone else who has posted, so talking down to them isn't fair, appreciated or funny. This thread isn't an argument, it's a debate. People like Buzz aren't trying to change anything, the reason people are posting is because they are explaining why it is they feel the way they do about their rights and the rights of others, and their thoughts on the opinions of the other posters. You don't like Buzz, we get it. Buzz gets it. Everyone gets it. Even before you posted in this thread. You're probably thinking that Buzz needs to be making a good impression because he's a JAC, and that he should be trying to be a role-model, be nice to people, be diplomatic about everything and take some responsibility regarding his role in the JA and not express his opinions like he has. Well to be honest mate, it's not Buzz's job to do that, it's mine. Buzz is the cheif of security, he deals with troublemakers, bannings of those who have broken the rules, keeps our Server passwords in check so that randomers don't show up or leaks don't get far, monitors applications, IPs and hotmasks so that offenders don't have the opportunity to rejoin after being banned and cause more unrest aswell as other, usual duties that we all have as JACs. And you know what? He does a damned good job, aswell. You don't have to like him, heck, you don't have to like any of us. It's not in the rules that you have to like the JAK+. But Buzz has just as much right to express his own personal opinions and beliefs as anyone else and to try to suggest that he shouldn't because he is an administrator is more than unfair. Buzz can be a little overly sarcastic at times but so can all of us, including me. The fact that he is a JAC is irrelevent. Not once has he ever threatened to ban someone, or even mention the fact that he is an admin to anyone who has disagreed with his personal opinion or doesn't like him. Not once. Your comments on this thread however have been patronizing, egotistical, disrepectful, self-elevated and rude to more people than just Buzz - and that actually is a rule violation on your part. Have a look back through the last few comments, even the people who have outrightly disputed Buzz's views still didn't appreciate your comments and have stated such. Quote: What is more to the point is that it's still pretty pathetic. You're BLATENTLY getting touchy over sucb a petty issue of which you can't really affect/change anyway... Again, you are calling all posters in this thread pathetic for a reason which is irrelevent. Again, no one is trying to change anything, they are merely explaining why they feel the way they do about the laws and rights that are in place, and they are well within their own rights to do so. It's not pathetic. Again, I'm not sure what you were trying to achieve by saying what you said in your posts, but please realise that it has pretty much turned this thread into what you were telling people (in a condescending way) to avoid in the first place. So please, refrain from doing this as you're not helping anything, not even slightly. And as a general statement to everyone: Let's try to avoid resorting to personal jibes in this thread because we're running out of points to make from here on, yes? 
- Virtue.  _______________ Academy Architect |
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planK - Jedi Council 
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Moving swiftly on from the mongoloid below...
"Though force can protect in emergency, only justice, fairness, consideration and co-operation can finally lead men to the dawn of eternal peace." -Dwight D. Eisenhower I ain't arguing with someone who saved the world. |
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Kenwan Obiobi - Student |
Quote: Kenwan, deleting offensive posts and replacing them with less objectional ones is really cowardly. If you have something to say, be a man and say it.
 Did that now did I? Care to...explain what posts they were? Because i sure as hell have no memory of them. Shut up if you haven't got anything to say which even REMOTELY makes any sense chap
Ssssh... |
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planK - Jedi Council
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Kenwan, deleting offensive posts and replacing them with less objectional ones is really cowardly. If you have something to say, be a man and say it. |
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Buzz - Student 
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Because believing we're in a civilized society where everyone is happy and there are no dangers to your personal safety so there is no need for a gun is a fantasy world. _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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Kenwan Obiobi - Student |
Quote:
Quote:
I've also belittled no one.
Quote: Living in a fantasy world is so nice, isn't it?
Yes, you have. Both quotes are from this thread. Touché... |
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Kenyon - Lord of the Dance 
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Quote: I've also belittled no one.
Quote: Living in a fantasy world is so nice, isn't it?
Yes, you have. Both quotes are from this thread. |
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Buzz - Student 
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Quote: How about they explain why I should not be allowed to protect myself, how I choose to.’
No one is saying you shouldn’t protect yourself, simply that there are other means. As for how you choose to, I’d let you choose any way you like as long as it doesn’t infringe upon the rights of others, as I think more widespread gun ownership might. In the words of the Utilitarian JS Mill ‘ your right to punch me ends at the start of my nose’ ‘Because I don't need to protect myself from everyone’ Then why do you need the right to carry a gun everywhere at all times? ‘Can you tell me who has given me the right to carry my gun?’ Since im not so sure you have a right, I couldn’t tell you, sorry. My carrying of a gun does not infringe on the rights of others. For your example from the utilitarian, just because I have fists doesn't mean I'm going to punch him in the face. And why do I need to carry a gun at all times? That's very simple. I'm not psychic. I might never need to use a gun for protection ever, but there also might be that one day where I would need it to protect myself. That'd really suck if that was the day I decided not to bring a gun along wouldn't it? And we'll save some semantic discussion about your indecision on my right to have a gun. I'm in the United States, I have the right to carry a gun. Who gave me that right? _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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Buzz - Student
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Sticking smileys behind your insults doesn't stop it from being an insult kenwan. It just makes it a smug insult by someone who thinks he's being clever. And frankly its getting old real fast. You were allowed to come back because you claimed you changed, and everyday its becoming painfully obvious that you haven't.
I know you wish everyone in the world could all just get along and never have any disagreements. That would be so wonderful if people were all to stupid to decide that there were different ways of doing things. I've not exploited anyone's views on the subject as you apparently think. I've also belittled no one. Using phrases like 'childish bickering' 'you're a funny boy' 'chap' calling something 'pathetic' 'sweetheart' that's belittling. _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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Kenwan Obiobi - Student |
I didn't start the fire. It was always burning as the world was turning. |
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planK - Jedi Council 
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omg I am so overwhelmed by how utterly cool Kenwan is. Seriously. He's so edgy, and funny, and cool, and omg I think I just peed!
Seriously. Yikes, dude.  |
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NotSoLittleCaesar - Student 
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Kenwan - if i was you, i wouldnt add fuel to the fire.. _______________ Quote: I mostly agree oh Lord of the squeezy mop
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Kenwan Obiobi - Student |
Awwww sweetheart...Does this mean we're finished? |
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Menaxia - Student 
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There's a difference between not tip-toeing and bashing every chance you get.
Kenwan - go be a wanker some place else. _______________ This is not the place to look for me |
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Monteeeeeee - Nugget 
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i find it funny people tip toe around buzz  _______________ If you add me to MSN, tell me who you are
Best Movie Character EVER!! |
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Kenwan Obiobi - Student |
Quote: Nope. I don't feel the need to. That doesn't mean I don't have the right though. And my right to own a gun is not predicated on my desire to own one.
And Kenwan, if you're not going to say anything constructive, then don't come in here commenting on what you wanting us to do. I haven't seen anyone in here complaining about "arguing" You're a funny boy
Lol i couldn't give a crap if no one else has complained about it. What is more to the point is that it's still pretty pathetic. You're BLATENTLY getting touchy over sucb a petty issue of which you can't really affect/change anyway...it's not just you...but you seem to want to exploit EVERYone's views on the subject...which is quite sad really . Just because someone else has an opinion...it doesn't mean you have to belittle them all the time. What am i expecting you to say from this? Little fragmented 'quotes' of parts of what i've said...in exactly or similar layout as to the structure of your comments below? Probably...but then again, it's totally fair to say that this Bee doesn't like other opinions apart from his own ...
"I AM right!!!111" Lighten up chap. This subject is going no where...apart from down the quite sad route of arguing? *WAVE* Show a smile! Hug a Buzz!!!
This comment was edited by Kenwan Obiobi on Apr 29 2007 05:33pm. |
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Lirael - Jedi Council 
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‘I'll put money down that your claim of shoe size and IQ would not work.’
Its been proven year after year after year in every first lesson in an a level statistics class ‘How about they explain why I should not be allowed to protect myself, how I choose to.’ No one is saying you shouldn’t protect yourself, simply that there are other means. As for how you choose to, I’d let you choose any way you like as long as it doesn’t infringe upon the rights of others, as I think more widespread gun ownership might. In the words of the Utilitarian JS Mill ‘ your right to punch me ends at the start of my nose’ ‘Because I don't need to protect myself from everyone’ Then why do you need the right to carry a gun everywhere at all times? ‘Can you tell me who has given me the right to carry my gun?’ Since im not so sure you have a right, I couldn’t tell you, sorry. ‘And if correlation does not equal causation, even in MY statistics, that means that gun ownership isn't related to gun crime in either direction. So there is no point in trying to further restrict firearms or ban them based on the justification of protecting society.’ The statistic of certain types of guns causing more damage i think does justify restricting certain types of guns based upon the justification of protecting society but we already agree on that. ‘And a lot are. Not every criminal is mentally ill, and not every criminal is high on crack or meth that they don't know what they're doing’ So why don’t you introduce cctv to dissuade these rational criminals? I’ve certainly never heard of anyone’s cause of death attributed to cctv. Big brother society FTW! _______________ I can write my name with my sparkler. My sparkler > your lightsabre |
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planK - Jedi Council
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Well, at least I know going to Ohio is safe now!
But seriously, this gun debate is headache material. I mean, both sides have got very good arguements and neither will concede or compromise. It's just one of those debates that will never end. All I can say on the matter is that no matter what you do, criminals WILL get their hands on guns. Btw, I have to say in terms of what Kenwan said, I do see this becoming slightly hostile. That's just how i'm personally seeing things, so it may or may not be true. Just remember guys, this is a civilized debate and we can all have buttsex afterwards okay! |
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Buzz - Student
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Quote: Buzz, do you own a gun?
Nope. I don't feel the need to. That doesn't mean I don't have the right though. And my right to own a gun is not predicated on my desire to own one. And Kenwan, if you're not going to say anything constructive, then don't come in here commenting on what you wanting us to do. I haven't seen anyone in here complaining about "arguing" _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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Kenwan Obiobi - Student |
Quote: Buzz, do you own a gun?
Lmao...was similar to what i was going to ask. This is funny stuff. Why can't you all stop bickering and agree?
Come on children...and Buzz |
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planK - Jedi Council
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Buzz, do you own a gun? |
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Buzz - Student
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Quote: No. It means what it says, I can come up with statistics that show a positive correlation with gun ownership and gun crime and you can come up with statistics that show a negative correlation between gun ownership and gun crime. That means that correlation is not the be all and end all. I can show a positive correlation between shoe size and IQ if I wanted so it’s not justified to argue that your one statistic is a reliable foundation for your argument.
I'll put money down that your claim of shoe size and IQ would not work. If you have information that shows gun crime dropping while gun ownership is dropping, and I can find information that shows gun crime dropping while gun ownership increases, then don't you think that its not the gun ownership causing the fluctuations in crime? Quote: Clearly some people here don’t understand why it is your right so perhaps you should explain why (i.e. the essential telos you hope to achieve) rather than just repeating your statement.
How about they explain why I should not be allowed to protect myself, how I choose to. Or how about explaining who has given people in the US the right to bear arms. Quote: I fail to see the inherent purpose of carrying a gun if everyone is not – as you argue (‘I'm not looking at every person walking down the street as a potential offender’)– a potential criminal
Because I don't need to protect myself from everyone. Let's just say that the good people outnumber the bad people by 100 to 1. I'm not concerned with the 100. I don't need to protect myself from them. I only need to protect myself from the 1. Quote: By using the term ‘inalienable right’ you are implying that it is a universal right to carry a gun
By the views of my culture it is. Can you tell me who has given me the right to carry my gun? Quote: And no matter how much you wish ‘correlation does not imply causation’ applies to everybody else’s statistics that contradict yours but not your own, it does actually apply universally.
And if correlation does not equal causation, even in MY statistics, that means that gun ownership isn't related to gun crime in either direction. So there is no point in trying to further restrict firearms or ban them based on the justification of protecting society. Quote: I though we had already established that a lot of crimes were not committed on a rational basis. I hardly think the mentally insane gunman at VT was at the height of his rational integrity when he shot over 30 of his fellow students.
And a lot are. Not every criminal is mentally ill, and not every criminal is high on crack or meth that they don't know what they're doing. And even if they are you might already be dead, so its better to at least increase your chance for survival. _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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Lirael - Jedi Council
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‘Quote:
Correlation does not imply causation. In other words, just because other countries with strict gun laws have lower rates of crime doesn't mean its a result of their lack of guns.’ No. It means what it says, I can come up with statistics that show a positive correlation with gun ownership and gun crime and you can come up with statistics that show a negative correlation between gun ownership and gun crime. That means that correlation is not the be all and end all. I can show a positive correlation between shoe size and IQ if I wanted so it’s not justified to argue that your one statistic is a reliable foundation for your argument. ‘Quote: 'Your views on guns have revealed your belief in considering every citizen to be a potential criminal. ' To assert that carrying a gun is your inalienable right also implies that you need to protect youtself potentially from anyone Only if they plan to commit a crime against me. I also don't neeed to assert that it is my inalienable right, because it is.’ Quote: You only need to carry a gun if they plan to commit a crime against you and you think that it is a right for everyone to be allowed to carry a gun at all times. It follows then that you are aware of everyone’s potential as a criminal. ‘‘I should rephrase myself: Instead of I do not feel it is an inalienable right, I do not feel it should be an inalienable right. But it is. Tough luck.’ The concept of inalienable human rights has some basis in natural law. I fail to see the inherent purpose of carrying a gun if everyone is not – as you argue (‘I'm not looking at every person walking down the street as a potential offender’)– a potential criminal. Clearly some people here don’t understand why it is your right so perhaps you should explain why (i.e. the essential telos you hope to achieve) rather than just repeating your statement. ‘Attemtping to apply one standard to the whole of the world is also worthless’ By using the term ‘inalienable right’ you are implying that it is a universal right to carry a gun. ‘No matter how much you wish it to be true, the number of gun owners is increasing in the US and the crimes don't reflect your beliefs of what should be happening.’ And no matter how much you wish ‘correlation does not imply causation’ applies to everybody else’s statistics that contradict yours but not your own, it does actually apply universally. ‘Tell me something, if you're a criminal, and you want to commit a crime, which person would you rather commit it against? A man with a gun, a man who you really don't know has a gun or not, or a man you are 99% certain will not have a gun? Who's the easier target?’ I though we had already established that a lot of crimes were not committed on a rational basis. I hardly think the mentally insane gunman at VT was at the height of his rational integrity when he shot over 30 of his fellow students. _______________ I can write my name with my sparkler. My sparkler > your lightsabre |
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Kenwan Obiobi - Student |
Buzz v1.0 (and co): Childish bickering at a place near YOU
Come on girls, keep it clean |
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Masta - Jedi Council 
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Well, i think the root cause of these senseless outbursts of violence against society is that we're living highly individualized lives in a very competitive-commercial environment, where the vast majority of us is solely focused on their own material needs and ambitions. This results in us fraternizing with our peers and giving only marginal attention to those outside of that narrow range. Infact, such a rather cliquey environment makes it very easy for outsiders who hopelessly struggle for inclusion, to start accumulating frustration due to their fate - locking away their pain until they blow up at the innocents.
If each one of us would take the time to at least adopt one of those who are seemingly lagging behind, giving a little bit of care to them and their lives, there would be no need for even more policing and our world would be a better and kinder place for all of us. _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
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