| FAQ - Jedi Knight Trials | |
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Virtue - Jedi Council  |
Permanent
Due to the amount of questions we receive at the JAC Q&A Sessions regarding Trials and Trial Procedures, I decided to write this FAQ.
I will add to it if more questions arise on the matter. 
------ What is involved in a Jedi Knight Trial? Jedi Knight Trials are very secret and only members of the JAK+ know exactly what is involved in one. The only information I will give out concerning what goes on, is that they consist of very precise and challenging tests of Skill, Morality, Mentality and Problem solving. Trials are skill specific, meaning that a Gunner won't be trialled, expecting to be highly skilled with a Lightsaber and/or Dueling. The Trials are engineered to be the ultimate test of an individual's specialty - IE. Gunning, Dueling, Full Force, etc. There are maps that have been built especially for the Trials and the maps themselves are built to test many of the prerequisites of being a Jedi Knight. Where are the Trial Maps and why are there no links to them on the site? See above. Jedi Knight Trials are very secret and mysterious. The only people who have these maps are the JAK+ and Students who are taking the Trials. The maps are sent to 'Trialees' via P2P (Peer To Peer) method (IRC, MSN, AIM, etc.) only minutes before their Trial starts, the maps are NOT uploaded to the website, nor can they be obtained via any hyperlink. Are Students allowed to watch other people being Trialled? No. Why all the secrecy? If everyone knew what was involved in the Trial procedures, the Trials would be made obsolete. People would train specifically just to pass the Trials, people would know about their secrets and answers and would render tests of morality, mentality and problem solving ineffective. Also, the Trials serve as a test of how people behave under extreme, stressful or nervous situations. There is a certain feel/atmosphere around Jedi Knight Trials and taking them which adds to the excitement of them. If everyone knew about them and what was involved in becoming a Jedi Knight - then all of this would be destroyed. The Academy would be made a little less exciting and we wouldn't be sure of the people we were promoting in respect to mentality, admin abuse, spirit and many of the other key things associated with being a Jedi Knight at the JA. How is anyone supposed to pass a Trial if they don't know anything about what is in them? I will not deny that the Jedi Knight Trials are very hard. But at the same time, if you are active in the JA and you attend Classes and/or Padawan sessions frequently, then you will be taught how to do many of the things that are involved in the Trials, we just don't tell you that you are learning Trial material. 
Not only do we teach you to be a better JK3 player, but we subtly teach you how to pass Trials. Each and every Class here at the JA has something different for you to learn about passing a Trial, you just won't know that you're learning it. 
Can you at least tell us about the procedure of Knight selection? That, I can do.
Students at the JA are constantly being evaluated by ranked members, even the freshly new recruits. Not in a very 'official' way, we're not spying on your every movement or anything - rather, we are merely watching how skilled you are, what you have learned from Classes/Padawan Sessions and how well you use the information you have learned. Your attitude and how you interact with other people is also a high factor in this procedure, how helpful you are and how you behave in some of those 'tricky' situations (Eg. When someone is laming, when someone is being offensive/annoying etc.). Don't be fooled by this, though, your input in these situations is neither required or requested - if a JAK+ is dealing with an offender, you are expected to carry on playing as normal - do not get involved. If there are no ranked members present, simply remind the offender of the rules in a diplomatic way whilst taking screenshots/condumps/demos of the offending actions and trying to contact a ranked member immediately. If your actions are found to be worthy of an opportunity for a Jedi Knight Trial, your name will be brought before the entire JAK+ body and you will be discussed. Factors that will influence this discussion are your attitude, skill, activity, your willingness to help others and your presence to most of the ranked members (The 'aura' you give). If, after this discussion, you are found to be a worthy candidate, you are then 'toggled'. What does 'Toggled' mean? 'Toggling' basically means "Your account at the JA has been flagged, opening it up to Trial information". There are four steps to Jedi Knight Trials, being toggled is the first. Once you are toggled, you can take the next step, which is the written exam. This consists of a list of questions for you to answer concerning the JA, the rules and/or policies, various in-game things, etc. Once you have submitted this exam, it is then discussed by the JAK+ and then graded by a JAC. If you get a 'pass' on your exam, you can then take the next step in the Trials.
How long are the Trials? If you mean 'How long are they from the day you are toggled, to the day you become a Jedi Knight', at shortest it can take two to three weeks to complete the entire process, in many cases, it can take a lot longer. There is a lot involved, especially for you.
What happens if someone fails a Trial? If, at any point during the process, a Trial is failed, then the potential Knight is given one more chance to get it right - A 'Re-Trial' is then scheduled no earlier than two weeks after the first initial failure. The potential Knight may not "pick up where he/she left off" ether, they must retake the entire Trial (Yes, I know, we are evil ).
If the re-trial is also failed, then the potential Knight is de-toggled and will remain a Student. This does not mean that this particular Student is discluded from Knight recommendations and discussions in the future, though. If someone who has failed a Trial is, over time, seen to have grown alot in skill and mentality, then they can indeed be considered to be toggled again. If a Student fails a Trial AND the Re-Trial, how long must he/she wait before being considered again? There is no time frame. It is simply a case of observation, just like any other Student. If that Student is seen to possess the skills required to pass a Jedi Knight Trial, then they will be discussed and toggled again. I really want to help this community by becoming a Jedi Knight, but so far, I have been unable to find a Master who can train me! Please do NOT be under the impression that "only Padawans are considered for Jedi Knights". This simply isn't true. We've had many Jedi Knights and Jedi Trainers in the past who have never had a Master at all. As long as you go to Classes, are active and are seen to be helpful and respectful, you will stand out to the ranked members. If you attend enough Classes here at the JA, you will learn what you need to learn.
------ - Virtue. 
_______________ Academy Architect This post was edited by solitude on Apr 18 2009 11:04pm. |
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Setementor - Jedi Master 
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A Lesson On Secrecy
Jedi Knight Trials These are secret, because if everybody knew what they were being tested on, they would train specifically to pass the tests themselves rather than training everything else as well. Troublemaker Details These are kept secret for two reasons. The first is that we want to keep the place as peaceful and seemingly trouble-free as possible. The second is that it would cause a lot of unnecessary flaming of them and degrade the community. Jedi Knight Requirements These haven't been particularly hidden or revealed; they are quite easy to see. Activity is a requirement - when knights are toggled they are active players in the community. Complaints These need to be kept private, again, to avoid a public rant and flame about it. There will always be problems and it is easier if you allow us to solve them professionally rather than in front of a demoralised crowd. Remember we are human as well. Anything Else That's Secret Anything else that's secret, is not particularly secret. We just try to preserve the mystery for new students and keep everything professional. This comment was edited by solitude on Apr 18 2009 11:08pm. |
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Z�diac Grimclaw - Ex-Student 
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I think its best to end the flame war. I dont like where this is going -_- _______________ Facta non verba. Omnia mutantur nos et mutamur in illis. Timendi causa est nescire... |
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SaZ - Student 
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We're totally fed up of these arguments, because they come up repeatedly, we explain why, and it happens again a few months later.
thats why some kind of reworked FAQ is needed in case something like that happens again. setementor did the first step already. It's the same people asking the same questions each time. That's the annoying part. if its the same question then obviously you guys dont need to write textwalls repeatedly without any answers and just go to the point. besides, writing those extremely long profesional (but pointless) posts takes much more time than just answering the question... im not really sure why we have to go through all the trouble and 'shield of secrets' to get simple answers to simple questions. so if you say TJA business is so timeconsuming... why are you doing all this. doesnt make sense. _______________ playing jk3 since 30th of january (2005), member since 1st of february. [Unofficial Master to Vision and Z�diac ] If you can make a fool of yourself infront of 300 people you can do anything - Jaiko D'kana This comment was edited by solitude on Apr 13 2009 11:38pm. |
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solitude - Jedi Council 
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We're totally fed up of these arguments, because they come up repeatedly, we explain why, and it happens again a few months later.
thats why some kind of reworked FAQ is needed in case something like that happens again. setementor did the first step already. It's the same people asking the same questions each time. That's the annoying part. _______________ Joined 16 October 2004 | Retired 10 April 2005 | Returned 05 June 2008 | Made Staff 27 June 2008 | Made Council 18 January 2009 Padawan To Odan-Wei Belouve | Adopted into the Belouve family | Twin to xAnAtOs | Owner of the 4th Quesi sexy badge  Brother To Roan Belouve, Nomad, Majno, Silkmonkey, Kensei and Jarhok Belouve
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SaZ - Student
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well in the past lets say... 20 times i was on server with some other people - there were no JAK+.
its just sad that JAK+ only go on servers when they have classes or events :/ i wish JAK+ were not bored of this game i guess :< When have you been on? I have been on the servers frequently. I haven't seen you but I have seen quite a few regulars. My point is just because YOU don't see someone on the servers does not mean they are not on. The fact is we all have real lives too and so our schedules might be different causing us to play at different times. Despite not seeing you, I do not doubt that you play often so please do not doubt that we play often as well. well as an euro player id expect euro players to play at some time between dinner and very late at night. i think such expectation is normal isnt it. *shrugs* Quote: We're totally fed up of these arguments, because they come up repeatedly, we explain why, and it happens again a few months later.
thats why some kind of reworked FAQ is needed in case something like that happens again. setementor did the first step already. _______________ playing jk3 since 30th of january (2005), member since 1st of february. [Unofficial Master to Vision and Z�diac ] If you can make a fool of yourself infront of 300 people you can do anything - Jaiko D'kana This comment was edited by SaZ on Apr 13 2009 05:53am. |
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Fullmetal D'Kana - Jedi Instructor 
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Quote: well in the past lets say... 20 times i was on server with some other people - there were no JAK+.
its just sad that JAK+ only go on servers when they have classes or events :/ i wish JAK+ were not bored of this game i guess :< When have you been on? I have been on the servers frequently. I haven't seen you but I have seen quite a few regulars. My point is just because YOU don't see someone on the servers does not mean they are not on. The fact is we all have real lives too and so our schedules might be different causing us to play at different times. Despite not seeing you, I do not doubt that you play often so please do not doubt that we play often as well. _______________ 
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solitude - Jedi Council 
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Quote: well in the past lets say... 20 times i was on server with some other people - there were no JAK+.
its just sad that JAK+ only go on servers when they have classes or events :/ i wish JAK+ were not bored of this game i guess :< Well, to be honest, that's the sad truth. We're totally fed up of these arguments, because they come up repeatedly, we explain why, and it happens again a few months later. Here is the fundamental problem - JKJA is an old game, activity is dwindling, and the game is dying. I'd love nothing more than to have JK4 announced, have everyone excited again, and have 32 people on a server every night enjoying the new game. Lucasarts has royally screwed us over in this respect. So, either we make the best of what we have, enjoy the community that we have build and just play and have some fun, or just pack our bags and go home. If you know of a viable replacement game for JKJA, I'm all ears, but I'm doubtful. _______________ Joined 16 October 2004 | Retired 10 April 2005 | Returned 05 June 2008 | Made Staff 27 June 2008 | Made Council 18 January 2009 Padawan To Odan-Wei Belouve | Adopted into the Belouve family | Twin to xAnAtOs | Owner of the 4th Quesi sexy badge Brother To Roan Belouve, Nomad, Majno, Silkmonkey, Kensei and Jarhok Belouve
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SaZ - Student 
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well in the past lets say... 20 times i was on server with some other people - there were no JAK+.
its just sad that JAK+ only go on servers when they have classes or events :/ i wish JAK+ were not bored of this game i guess :< _______________ playing jk3 since 30th of january (2005), member since 1st of february. [Unofficial Master to Vision and Z�diac ] If you can make a fool of yourself infront of 300 people you can do anything - Jaiko D'kana This comment was edited by SaZ on Apr 12 2009 12:34pm. |
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solitude - Jedi Council
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Quote: and... have YOU see him?
i cant even expect a honest answer to this question, because you are much less active than most of the students. even if you saw him... well read the end of the post for my theory about that. Yes, I have seen him around. No, I am not hugely active on the game servers, I normally spend a while each day doing forums/apps/emails/background admin stuff on the servers. If I need to I'll log into the admin console and keep an eye on things, but I am not visible in game as a player much. That said, if a server is empty - which it often is - what's the point of forcing JAK on? If you actually *need* one, we arn't that hard to get hold of. It's worth pointing out also the number of classes that have been held where either nobody enrolls, or people enroll and do not turn up. We are not trying to redefine activity, it is clear that some JAK+ are more active than others - but why force a high level of activity on an inactive community? _______________ Joined 16 October 2004 | Retired 10 April 2005 | Returned 05 June 2008 | Made Staff 27 June 2008 | Made Council 18 January 2009 Padawan To Odan-Wei Belouve | Adopted into the Belouve family | Twin to xAnAtOs | Owner of the 4th Quesi sexy badge Brother To Roan Belouve, Nomad, Majno, Silkmonkey, Kensei and Jarhok Belouve
Owner Of Virtue's 1000th profile comment, Mr. Doobie's 1000th profile comment, Gradius' 2500th comment, xAnAtOs' 2500th comment, Rosered's 1500th comment, Laziana's 900th comment, Scythus' 500th comment and Echuu's 100th comment |
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SaZ - Student
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gj sete on the sticky post.
if you think of anything related to this put it there as well so if anyone has any kind of questions you can just link to this thread. _______________ playing jk3 since 30th of january (2005), member since 1st of february. [Unofficial Master to Vision and Z�diac ] If you can make a fool of yourself infront of 300 people you can do anything - Jaiko D'kana |
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Augusta_Mintaka - Student 
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This all seems blown way out of proportion. _______________ "Deos fortioribus adesse." |
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Carve - Student 
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*pulls one butt-cheek to the side*
*farts* _______________ © |
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Sauce - =^.^= 
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Quote: rofl u guys are nerds. |
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Xorb - Student 
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It might have been simpler to remind us what a JAK is selected to do. Masta was obviously selected because the JAC feels he can do this:
Jedi Academy Knight (JAK) - Knights are the bridge between the upper management and the students, so if you feel ignored from the big boys, go to the JAKs and they will support you. These are the students’ best friends. Treat them that way. They are meant to assist the teachers on giving classes, keeping order on servers and generally helping students out. Knights are not chosen for “l33t” skills (although they should be good fighters of course) but for their attitude. Also, they have limited access to admin commands, so they can keep order at the servers as well. If you’re having trouble or want to learn some basic stuff, knights are the first place to go to. It seems to do this job, you only need to make yourself available to the community, either on IRC or on the servers, and be willing and able to help out students when asked. Spending large amounts of time "in game" does not seem to be required. I'm sure everyone agrees Masta fits this description quite well. Perhaps the requirements listed above should be reworded to specifically say "active in the community" to eliminate any ambiguity. _______________ Cleaning out scum and villainy . . . one wretched hive at a time. |
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Lirael - Jedi Council 
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I have the official assistant nasty job, so here goes.
Most of you aren’t happy with our answers, I know why, I was a student once, not that long ago, thinking the same thing. What I perceived as politically correct comments were incredibly frustrating and I didn’t think the JAK+ were doing anything much and what they were doing was ineffective. However, as other people have emphasised, e-drama is not the way to go about raising these issues. Ask questions to us on an individual basis about your concerns you will have our respect, full attention and we will give you an honest answer and try to explain things from our perspective. Now this may look like another politically correct post to you, but I am being honest in my opinions. It’s not easy to make posts like this – it seems every time someone has been promoted recently there has been very little in the way of congratulations or recognition into the time they have voluntarily given up. To say that’s not very nice for the person being promoted or the JAK+ trying to think of ways to promote more people or get increased activity on the severs is an understatement. For the last time: we trial who we think are appropriate. We put a lot of time in to organise these trials and help people pass them. This is not a democracy, it is a (benevolent) dictatorship. You are free and encouraged to suggest people who we should consider, but we do not have to promote every person suggested. That doesn’t mean we don’t consider these suggestions seriously. I have seen countless posts saying ‘Why isn’t X a knight yet?’ when they are currently being trialled or have failed the trials. The trials are HARD. Anyone who passes them deserves respect. We give up our time for you guys, the students so you can have fun with this game. And I am getting very tired of comments that only berate the time and effort we put in and don’t put any positive suggestions across themselves. The reason that people don't suggest positive things we CAN do is because it’s very easy to criticise what other people are doing. It’s much harder to suggest what should be done, which is what we try to do. There, nasty job over, I await the burning effigies. edit: Bringing up your concerns politely here, as several posters have, is of course fine, but it remains easier to reply to people in an individual conversation. My comment is mainly aimed at less restrained posts and unconstructive attitudes. Back on topic everyone. _______________ I can write my name with my sparkler. My sparkler > your lightsabre This comment was edited by Lirael on Apr 11 2009 11:27pm. |
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Kainz00r - Jedi Knight 
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Sauce put it best, there is hilarious attempts to define the term 'activity' here. Masta is active on forums, but he is not even remotely close to what I would define as 'active' in the game itself. Therefore, server activity is clearly not required for JAK+ status anymore - but that's fair I'd say, because the game itself is also far from active these days. And, as was also mentioned, Masta's promotion was long overdue anyways, so even if server activity was a requisite 'once upon a time' he surely met that, and he's proved to be more than a capable player, both in the past and recently.
I don't see anything wrong with players knowing what the trials are about either. I see arguements here suggesting that knowledge of trial content would render said trials redundant - if that is true, then I would be so bold as to say then the trials are too easy. I know how to do every single combo and swing using a single saber for example, but have I mastered applying them optimally in every duel or tffa situaiton I am confronted with? I am also extremely comfortable with movement in jk3, but how can I be certain I could traverse any course given to me correctly in a time frame (something from JAA trials there)? Making trial content public knowledge would give the students aspiring for knighthood a bar to reach, right now it's just be nice, post often, and... well that's about it really, if we're going to be honest here. A few years back, activity ingame would have been a big plus I imagine, but times have changed clearly, more for the game's community reasons than the will of the jak+ in my opinion. The concerns raised in this thread are understandable for me as well, but I get the impression that Solitude disagrees with me on that point. And let's not forget, the judgement of 'who is ready for knighthood' is ultimately subjective to a minority of this community, and could be endlessly debated, so I'm not gonna talk about that point at all, we all know the score really. Bit of a long post but oh well, figured I should add a bit of input to this while we're on the topic, since I've been here for quite some time as well. _______________ Fervent supporter of duelling - leave a message if you would like to battle! Married to Masta. |
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SaZ - Student
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Quote: omg it all sounds as a load of jealous cr*p..just leave it be..
i would be jealous if i could actually do something that JAK needs to do. All i could offer to other students is teach how to use the 'LOL' bind efficiently. Then again those foolish enough to actually want such training would have to go through constant laming, whining and many other things worse than those. _______________ playing jk3 since 30th of january (2005), member since 1st of february. [Unofficial Master to Vision and Z�diac ] If you can make a fool of yourself infront of 300 people you can do anything - Jaiko D'kana |
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Milosh - Student 
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omg it all sounds as a load of jealous cr*p..just leave it be.. _______________ Proud fan of DJ Laziana |
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SaZ - Student
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Quote: Why Do you guys care
well, after someone becomes a JAK, you would expect to see him/her atleast once on the servers. that is all... _______________ playing jk3 since 30th of january (2005), member since 1st of february. [Unofficial Master to Vision and Z�diac ] If you can make a fool of yourself infront of 300 people you can do anything - Jaiko D'kana |
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ShadowJedi - Student 
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First of all ,
Why Do you guys care if someone is taking ( and passing ) The Trial they have .. Second , If YOU would pass a trial , How you feel when someone is asking : Why HE became a Knight and not me ... I am more active and .. bla bla bla Third , If HE/THEY Are passing their trials , good to them , that means they work hard , helping the academy , and deserves it , Not making Stupid posts about it .. Now Cut Off-Topic Posts *me cuts off-topic posts* -SJ _______________ ->SJ<- "Never fall to the Dark Side , They Do not have Cookies" |
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SaZ - Student
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Quote: speak to us in private and convince us to make a public announcement
while this sounds like a decent idea... when you think about it ..what kind of announcement regarding this problem you would make? 'we would like to remind you that activity is not important for knights' ? O_o i guess you should remake the main post of the thread, or make a new one regarding any questions regarding this. this is not the first discussion about stuff like this... ofcourse make it as clear as possible... then make an announcement about such thread and i guess everything will be fine _______________ playing jk3 since 30th of january (2005), member since 1st of february. [Unofficial Master to Vision and Z�diac ] If you can make a fool of yourself infront of 300 people you can do anything - Jaiko D'kana This comment was edited by SaZ on Apr 11 2009 05:53pm. |
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Setementor - Jedi Master
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Masta uses an alias sometimes as well.
Quote: im pretty sure that a lot of less... loud... members of this community, especially the new ones and ones that like to see the reason behind everything, had a simmilar thought in their minds. if they dont say it - that doesnt mean they dont think about this. hiding everything like that would just make everything worse.
Then you should come and speak to us in private and convince us to make a public announcement about it and/or correct the problem. You'll find the staff are very open minded in everything they do. It's just unprofessional for us to answer and deal with these kinds of issues over a public forum. This isn't a discussion nor related to our current JAK+; it's a Q&A regarding Jedi Knight trials. Talk to us in private, give us the details of your complaint and we'll do something about it, as Masta rightly tried to make out below. |
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SaZ - Student
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yay Sauce.
a person who doesnt try to go 'omg you noobs dont question our actions' and is honest. you JAK+ should really drop 90% of the whole UNNEEDED secrecy crap. would save you a lot of trouble 'answering' (most of the attempts to answer here are more like dodging anyway) questions like these. the cloud of coolness you are trying to create isnt helping. ofcourse now you might think 'of fuuuu...'. im just being honest. _______________ playing jk3 since 30th of january (2005), member since 1st of february. [Unofficial Master to Vision and Z�diac ] If you can make a fool of yourself infront of 300 people you can do anything - Jaiko D'kana This comment was edited by SaZ on Apr 11 2009 05:38pm. |
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Sauce - =^.^= 
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btw
pwned. |
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Sauce - =^.^=
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it is easy to see that the Masta was promoted because he'll be able to bring something new to the academy's curriculum. imo, his promotion was long overdue.
as regards to the student's question of whether activity is essential to being a jak+, the answer is clearly no. if you mean activity as in being on the servers on a regular basis, interacting, and guiding the students, the answer is self-evident. the reason saz and cactus keep responding is because of the jak+'s hilarious attempt of trying to redefine the word "activity" as we know it. i mean come on. just be honest. prolly only 3 of the 10 JAT/JAK's have been on the servers for more than 1 hr last week. Dash, Laz, and Setementor for those of you who are wondering. but with this said, i don't see how activity should be a requirement if the JAK+'s don't want it to be. l2deal n00bs. |
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Maher - Jedi Knight 
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Quote: and... have YOU see him?
JAK+ is working as one unit ? Basically It means that we have 34 eyes... Can you image what you can see with 34 eyes ? Pretty much everything... eventhought It only needs two eyes and most certainly some eyes are active, always... _______________ Still here | My Lightsaber |
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