| 'dark' and 'light' Jedi and playing the role | |
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Eldrin - ex-Student |
I guess like me most people have a preference for dark or light powers. My preference is light though I think dark powers are more powerful. My reason for prefering light is purely a roleplaying one. Sometimes I might feel like playing an evil guy/girl and will take dark powers but mostly I prefer light.
Now the subject I want to start a discussion on is the roleplay aspect. I might choose to play a light jedi most of the time but then I get in game and it seems most people don't differentiate between light and dark jedi. I would not be surprised and even expect to see dark and light jedi teaching each other etc. Is it not possible to set aside servers for more roleplay? Servers where light jedi don't look like sith, Chewbacca/Padme etc. aren't jedi, 'light' jedi fight only 'dark' jedi (and vise versa) etc. I could and prehaps should say more but I feel this is sufficient to start the discussion. ps If this should be in another forum please feel free to move it or berate me. This post was edited by Eldrin on Dec 19 2002 01:15pm. |
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Silent Whisper - Retired 
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Ok they SHOULD not hate. But what if they do? Does that mean they are any less of a Jedi? _______________ "I have learned from Vergere only that there is no such thing as sides of the Force....for the side is merely a reflection of your intentions of the Force. Use it in hate, and it will be hate. Use it offensively in good, and you will find my Truth." -Jacen Solo, "Traitor", New Jedi Order |
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Kay Mata - Ex-Student |
Silent whisper, i didn't say i Jedi can't hate, but SHOULD not hate, maybe it wasn't clear enough...my bad _______________ Back for good... |
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Eeth Koth - Student 
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"Palpatine unleashed a deadly barrage of dark side energy on the young Jedi. Lightning bolts spawned from pure evil tore into Luke's body with searing pain."
That is a quote from starwars.com's movie section, describing Force lightning.(read the profile on darth vader) As you can see, even the idea of forming lightning requires intense focus on hate, and evil thoughts. If a Jedi has to use hate to do something, it is no longer a Jedi ability and he is treading on dark side powers. Jedi couldn't even use lightning to flashcook a potroast. What they intend to do with the lightning, is irrelevant. Lightning simply cannot be formed through emotionless and calm behavior, which is the way that the Jedi use the Force. As for anything read in the New Jedi Order series, it cannot be considered official. It is part of the expanded universe, and the EU contradicts itself too much to be used as a legitimate piece of evidence. Lucas clearly intended for lightning to be a dark only power. As for yoda throwing lightning at dooku, it wasn't him creating it, he was merely deflecting it. Similar to how jedi deflect a blaster shot back at their attack with their lightsabers, a jedi can deflect this lightning attack with the Force. The Jedi in the movies have stated several times that they do believe in the dark side and light side, and nothing in between. I think its safe to assume that the Jedi, who have studied the Force for thousands of years know a few more things about it than we do. If you start using dark powers, you become corrupted. Now, obviously if we use dark powers here in jk2 we don't become evil, but in the "real" star wars universe, you would. |
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Silent Whisper - Retired 
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Why can't a Jedi hate? So Jedi are to love Siths? So a Jedi must go their whole life not feeling resentment of someone of something? _______________ "I have learned from Vergere only that there is no such thing as sides of the Force....for the side is merely a reflection of your intentions of the Force. Use it in hate, and it will be hate. Use it offensively in good, and you will find my Truth." -Jacen Solo, "Traitor", New Jedi Order |
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Kay Mata - Ex-Student |
this is well explained, but i still think we should play roles... and also Jedi can't "hate" the Siths because it doesn't go into "what should a good Jedi do or not" book _______________ Back for good... |
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Darth Revan - Ex-Student 
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Well said. I think you totally explained it better than anyone else. _______________ formally known as jedi master, vanished and returned as the new sith lord |
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Buzz - Student 
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Most of Silent's thoughts on this come from the NJO novel Traitor. Its an excellent novel to gain a different understanding of the Force. Yes "grey" is a made up term for the Force but I think you're missing the point of what it means. Everyone looks at the Force as light and dark, sith and jedi. What Grey means is that there aren't sides its the combination of light and dark. Traitor can also answer your questions about the cave on Dagobah being darkside. But I think Jedi Master is right as well, The dark Jedi on Dagobah was so full of negative and dark emotions that when he was killed he left a stain in the Force on that spot Hence they feel waves of negative feelings affecting the Force. Don't forget Yoda blocked the lightning from count dooku and sent it back at him, if it was truly a "dark side" only power how could he send it back. If Dooku didn't block it with his own lightning it would have hit him. I think Jedi can become angry and everything like that. Remember the Emperor ddn't care if Luke got angry, he wanted him to release it and use it against Darth Vader. Also Obi Wan looked pretty pissed when Maul killed Qui Gon, but that but he didn't kill Maul for vengeance he killed him because he was a danger and needed to be stopped so he wouldn't kill others. Luke uses Grip on the Gammorrean guards and that's seen mostly as a "dark side" power. But he didn't kill them and he didn't do it out of anger. Lightning I believe can be seen the same way. A Jedi uses the Force for defense which means that a jedi can kill but not using the force since to kill you must attack. So if you use Lightning as a defensive measure and not doing it out of anger or other negative emotions then you will not fall to your darkness.
The Secret of the Jedi is that there is no Dark side. The Jedi are all about control and never getting out of control for fear of giving into their personal darkside. Since the Force isn't actually a sentient being and can't choose sides or have control over itself, the Force in its purest form without any control is what a Jedi sees as the Dark Side. This is why Yoda say its quicker and easier since it really takes no control and without control it becomes easier to give into one's dark desires. If one can touch this without control and not give into his negative emotions and dark desires then he is grey, not light or dark but someone that can use the Force without falling into the darkness. Sorry if this got kind of long. _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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Darth Revan - Ex-Student
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Silent hit the nail on the head a few comments ago. I see my self as good but enjoy using all sides of the force. As silent said how can an energy field choose sides when it can't think?
To answer Malky's question they can feel dark energy in the cave because yoda killed a dark jedi in there. (read heir to the empire) Therefore the anger and hate in him was released. Just like light jedi and dark jedi can sense each others presence. _______________ formally known as jedi master, vanished and returned as the new sith lord This comment was edited by Darth Revan on Dec 22 2002 04:12pm. |
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Malk - Student 
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Well I don't think I can answer your question about how an energy field can take sides, but I got a question for you.
To quote you from an earlier post: "Dark comes from yourself and your own "dark" ambitions." in The Empire Strikes Back when Yoda is training Luke, they feel the Dark Side coming from a cave. If an energy field doesn't take sides then how do Luke and Yoda feel the dark side coming from a cave? _______________ You swing too hard, ass. I Swear!!! |
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Silent Whisper - Retired
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So we're back to sides again. I don't think anyone answered my question. How can an energy field take sides? It has no feelings, no brain, no conscience. _______________ "I have learned from Vergere only that there is no such thing as sides of the Force....for the side is merely a reflection of your intentions of the Force. Use it in hate, and it will be hate. Use it offensively in good, and you will find my Truth." -Jacen Solo, "Traitor", New Jedi Order This comment was edited by Silent Whisper on Dec 22 2002 12:32pm. |
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Eeth Koth - Student
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There is a difference between Jedi and Sith powers. "Uber" or "grey" jedi is pretty much a made up term, not official by any means. There are some things that are clearly on one side of the Force, and cannot be used by the other side no matter what the intent is behind it. Force lightning is an example, for only a dark side user can do this. A light sided Jedi wouldn't be able to use Force lightning for even lighting up a campfire, as it is a dark ability which requires you to concentrate on your hate to activate, which we all know is something a Jedi should never do. |
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Huxley - Retired 
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I agree with M'Lady Whisper. Using her words to me:
When you get angry, and hurt someone, Is it because you, the person, of the Force that made you do it? Because you choose to do it, not because a dark side tells you to. |
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Eldrin - Ex-Student |
Yeah I noticed the similarity with quiditch. |
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Vaughn - Student 
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hey Eldrin, that sport, why dont you just add big balls trying to kill everybody, and a smaller ball that you have to catch to win and just call it quidditch? (er, thats taken, nvm  , other than that, sounds fun :p)
Edit: Silent. Without evil there can be no good, so it must be good to be evil some time!!! (South Park the movie ). People define Dark jedi as jedi who use the force for harm and pain towards others. Light jedi are the jedi who use the force as a tool to heal, or do "good". Its kinda like Kenshin - he started trying to use his sword techniques to protect, but then he became an assassin, and at the end of the OAV he decided never to use it again... I dont know where im going with this Edit, but...- Wether there is a true dark side or not, the force doesnt take sides, the force is one - it just depends on who uses it and for what purpose which makes you dark or light. _______________ When you become an actor, you become the person, and you dont act anymore. You just are. - Tyler HP, Taught by Mr G Simpson This comment was edited by Vaughn on Dec 21 2002 02:40pm. |
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Silent Whisper - Retired
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I think you need a professional opinion on that. Uber Jedis believe there are sides to the Force. But really what defines a "side?" Can an all powerful energy field really take sides? The "grey" Jedi believe the Force is one. Dark comes from yourself and your own "dark" ambitions.
My apologies if this sounds preachy _______________ "I have learned from Vergere only that there is no such thing as sides of the Force....for the side is merely a reflection of your intentions of the Force. Use it in hate, and it will be hate. Use it offensively in good, and you will find my Truth." -Jacen Solo, "Traitor", New Jedi Order |
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Eldrin - Ex-Student |
Huh? |
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Darth Revan - Ex-Student 
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Err...what about Uber Jedis? _______________ formally known as jedi master, vanished and returned as the new sith lord |
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Veydar Beeurd - Student |
Sounds like fun 
I'm currently making a JK2 Map based on a Sith Temple, at it's current stage of construction, I could easily convert it to a Sith Academy. |
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Eldrin - Ex-Student |
Sounds good DJ.
On a side note I hve been thinking about making a map/script for a sort of sport. There would be teams and a ball that you could kick or use push/pull on and holes/rings/goals to get the ball through to score points. I've also had other ideas along those lines... what do you think? |
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DJ Sith - Jedi Council 
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Ya know what? The best roleplay I've done on the server was a kind of stormies vs Jedi thing.. The stormies would all gather in the courtyard and get guns and weapons and junk and try to storm the temple while the Jedi fought valiantly to drive them back. Depending on the specific rules and the number of stormies v Jedi it can be quite fun. _______________ My car is made of Nerf. |
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Eldrin - Ex-Student |
If I could run a server and play on others I would.
A roleplaying class would be great. I'd teach it if I weren't a lam... ahem... learner  |
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Silencio - Student 
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I like to think of myself as some sort of "grey" jedi. I used to make low-force-level characters in JK1, just so that I could use powers from both sides. in jk2 my powers are light.
but, that aside, a new roleplaying class would be sweet. Used to do it on the servers back when Lian was still here, but no one seems interested in it anymore  a shame, really, now that we have a biig new map and all _______________ Second-in-command of the mighty FiZZsters |
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Veydar Beeurd - Student |
If I had a server I would let you use it... But I don't... So I can't... |
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DJ Sith - Jedi Council
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Alot of people have tried starting up Sith Academys for all the dark siders out there, but none of them really took off. If you want to make one up then go on ahead.
We used to have roleplay classes, but they kinda stopped a few monthsback. Any JATs feel like a role play class again? Since all our servers are in use right now we'd need someone else to donate us a server. Any takers? _______________ My car is made of Nerf. |
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Veydar Beeurd - Student |
Heh, I was thinking about that too, we have a Jedi Academy, so why not have a Sith Academy.
It'd probably only complicate things, but would be cool from an RP perspective |
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