| Bible Study | |
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Koyi Donita - Student  |
Yep. Here it is. My first offical Forum and of course it's about my favorite topic, The Bible. Basically, I would like this to be an open forum based on the Bible and the truths held with in. If anyone has any Biblical truths that they would like to share with everyone, I ask for you to please put it up on the table as we will all search for truth in God's Word. If anyone has any questions, maybe collectively we may be able to help them through the Bible God willing. I only ask that if you have no faith or have nothing constructive to post, please respect my wishes and just ignore this forum. All questions from non-believers are welcome as long as you seriously seek God's truth. May God bless us all through his wonderful Word. Quote: For those of you who like, this site has every translation. Plus search, studies, GREAT RESOURCE The Bible Gateway -DM- Thank you Darth Mobility.  _______________ For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. Rom. 1:16 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom. 10:17 I love my babyface. Smilykrazy is my baby and I love her. ...Swimming through the void we hear the Word, we lose ourselves but we find it all... System Of A Down.  This post was edited by Koyi Donita on Apr 30 2005 05:38pm. |
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Gil-Galad - Student 
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Quote: In any case, mankind is doomed from it's rebellion with this just being the opening story of it all. We can all thank Satan for that suggestion but I'm sure that we probably would have messed things up at some point or another. God has given us the story which has a spiritual lesson I'm sure. An honest question here Koyi, and I understand you may not have the answer. I am aware that the majority of christians believe the 'fall' to be symbolic, and I understand why, and I can kind of see what they are referring to. However, as a fundamentalist, why do you think it is that we must suffer for what Adam and Eve did? Why was their sin so special that it transferred to the rest of humanity for the rest of eternity? My sins dont mean you are punished, why did theirs mean that? _______________ |JAA| since 02/05/06 Green for life |
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Aayla Secura - Ex-Student 
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I found the Bible is just down as much to interpretation as actually words. And if you believe the bible to wholly be written by God which I’m sensing you do, nothing wrong with that – Has its advantages. But personally see the Bible written by Mortals loosely guided by God and therefore human prejudice therefore by default seeped into the Bible. Now I’m not saying to rewrite the Bible; but for some understanding that parts of the Bible could be incorrect, not because God was wrong, because he never wrote it (but gave the lesson we must learn from it, Woman are not lesser, but that Human's are sometimes subject to doing Wrong), but because of the weaknesses of Humans. There are two creation stories – why was Adam and Eve needed? (That’s going into Church’s views of Women NOT Gods) Even then the other creation story women are called Wo-Men – the very name is derived from men. Many people would see that sexism, but I believe it was needed due to the times the Bible was written in, but failure to keep up with present ideals is quite blatantly pushing people away from Religion. Now many would argue its society that is wrong not the Bible – but what I have found is that society only challenges out dated prejudices within the Bible. Wasn’t Jesus seen as wrong because he challenged the ideals of the Jewish Religion? While he was alive? Saying to love one other? Now I’m not saying feminists are sons or daughters of God in that sense, but He changed what was wrong – that is all I see feminist theologians are trying to do. _______________ IN UR FACE I'M NOT BLONDE! This comment was edited by Aayla Secura on Mar 03 2005 08:59am. |
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Koyi Donita - Student 
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Quote: To be honest after only studying religion and philosophy for a year I can easily say I want nothing to do with any religion, Adam and Eve, basically to put woman in their plac (subservient and lesser to men) I can see where this story and the whole idea's behind it can upset a great many people, but that isn't all the Bible says on that issue. It tells us that men are supposed to love their wives as Christ loved the Church. To love them as themselves and the same for the woman. The chain of command was established to show us something spiritual, but man took it to a whole different level spotted with ugly disrespect. I could see the early church age being to blame for that where people where Bible banging trying to feel out religion for both God and themselves. It is taught in the Bible that a woman should keep silent in a church never having authority to teach over man and learn from their husbands. This type of teaching or practice can easily be blown out of wack with foolish male pride and could have been the cause for some of the sexist behavior in our country. The world [alot of different cultures] from what I have been taught pretty much kept the same practice of men being greater then women. Maybe physical strength plays a part in this? Men suck. Quote: Eve herself was never told not to eat to apple, if you notice; but that’s another issue, another out dated and unneeded prejudice. In fact we are just doing feminism theology. We also don't have a play by play of all discussions from the beginning throughout the story. To think anything more or less then what God wrote for us wouldn't be a very wise thing to do. I would imagine Adam telling her [she did tell the serpent that they weren't to eat of that tree], but pure speculation and an unprofitable idea I'm sure. In any case, mankind is doomed from it's rebellion with this just being the opening story of it all. We can all thank Satan for that suggestion but I'm sure that we probably would have messed things up at some point or another. God has given us the story which has a spiritual lesson I'm sure. _______________ For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. Rom. 1:16 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom. 10:17 I love my babyface. Smilykrazy is my baby and I love her. ...Swimming through the void we hear the Word, we lose ourselves but we find it all... System Of A Down.
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Aayla Secura - Ex-Student
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To be honest after only studying religion and philosophy for a year I can easily say I want nothing to do with any religion, Adam and Eve, basically to put woman in their plac (subservient and lesser to men) Eve herself was never told not to eat to apple, if you notice; but that’s another issue, another out dated and unneeded prejudice. In fact we are just doing feminism theology. _______________ IN UR FACE I'M NOT BLONDE! This comment was edited by Aayla Secura on Mar 02 2005 09:32am. |
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Gil-Galad - Student
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Quote: we? we killed Jesus? I've never even seen him. Ancient Italians i.e. Romans,Where thought to have executed Jesus of Nazerus?(spelling?).They where the only ones I know to crucify people.So we suffer damnation because of the stupidy of an ancient and fearful goverment? Yup, for more material of this nature see: Adam and Eve. _______________ |JAA| since 02/05/06 Green for life |
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Plo Koon - Student 
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Quote:
Quote: Hmm, If God can do whatever he wants, and change anything he wants in a shorter time than one-one millionth of a nano-second wouldn't he end all suffering? Sorry to jump back a bit, but I saw this, and it reminded me of a discussion a bit earlier. Someone in the discussion literally said: "Ah, but who says God hasn't stopped caring after we killed his son?" Generally, that's a good question. Jesus may have risen from the grave, but still, we executed someone who brought us a message of love. I think we can/could expect a certain form of anger for this, in any case. What are your thoughts about it, people? we? we killed Jesus? I've never even seen him. Ancient Italians i.e. Romans,Where thought to have executed Jesus of Nazerus?(spelling?).They where the only ones I know to crucify people.So we suffer damnation because of the stupidy of an ancient and fearful goverment? _______________ Free Tibet! Click this link,and learn Here too |
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Jo_Mintaka - Student 
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YAY! bible study! awesome! one of the reasons for me coming to the JA is because every other server was cussing and i hated it,until i found the jedi academy! now i can relax knowing that no one will cuss! HURRAY! _______________ Joined Jan 27 2005 [Owner of Pink Floyd's 525th, 1100th and 4002nd comments! Darth Mike's accidental 999 and 1001 comments! addiat's 1975 comment! |
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Koyi Donita - Student 
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Quote: Why deny philosophy? Where would human civilization be without philosophy? I feel God gave us free will so we could figure our religion and civilization out on our own. When we messed up, he sent Jesus to right our religious wrongs. Honestly if you want a good insight to the Catholic faith mixed with a bit of humor watch Dogma, they did their homework on that Only problem I see with this is some of our well thought out philosophies could work against the Word of God. I'm sure not all philosophy is bad, but if it conflicts with the Bible, I would stay away from it. About God and free will is a tough subject, but I would like to point to the book of John on this one. In John maybe chapter two or three, (I don't have my Bible handy and I'm late for work) Nicodemus approached Jesus ask a few questions and it is a very curious conversation because it appears as if the two of them weren't understanding one another. Anyhow, I believe that Jesus tells him in order to enter the kingdom of God, one must become born again or reborn. Nicodemus asks if he must enter into his mothers womb again and Jesus tells him that he must be reborn of water and spirit. Water can be shown to be the gospel and the Spirit is God's Holy Spirit working within us to will and to do of His good pleasure. This is further outlined in the first charpter of John when God tells us that his sons and daughters are born not of the flesh, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. Free will, to a certain degree is an illusion. Sure we can chose this and that, but God tells us in Romans that not one is righteous, no, not one and no one seeks after Him so when it comes to believing and worshipping God, the ball appears to be totally in His court. All we can do is humbly ask if we can play too and hope His grace is sufficent enough to add us to His team. We've done great studies on this in the past although I'm sure its really buried.  This is just my interpretation of the Bible and I will be more then willing to post the actual scriptures if anybody wants me to. Also, I saw Dogma and it was a rather funny movie, however, I don't agree with the Catholic interpretation of the Bible along with their extra books, doctrines, confessions, and practices. At best, that movie was taking blind stabs at the most tender parts of the faith without really searching out the truth. Like the whole "What is bound on earth will be bound in heaven" scriptures. Those have been translated horribly wrong from what I have heard, (haven't had the time or proper study to search it out myself). Them making God something physical and goofy wasn't cool to my taste either. I will go as far as to call it some classic Jay and Silent Bob action though. _______________ For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. Rom. 1:16 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom. 10:17 I love my babyface. Smilykrazy is my baby and I love her. ...Swimming through the void we hear the Word, we lose ourselves but we find it all... System Of A Down.
This comment was edited by Koyi Donita on Feb 28 2005 04:05pm. |
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Sauron-the-rasta-mon - Student 
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Quote: "No where is it ever said in the Bible that God gave man an eternal soul" This is what made me realize why the Christian faith is so seperated. I find that statement, in my opinion, totally wrong. If man has no eternal soul, what is the purpose of His kingdom? If God never gave man an eternal soul, then why would he send his Son to save us? Why would he send his Son to judge us? If you believe in Jesus Christ, as I'm sure most of the Christian faith generally does, how could such a statement be correct in any form? It can't, I don't mean to sound like I'm shooting down your opinion (whoever or wherever this came from) but that sounds so wrong to me. Can you see where I'm coming from anyone? Also Quote: 8) Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. Why deny philosophy? Where would human civilization be without philosophy? I feel God gave us free will so we could figure our religion and civilization out on our own. When we messed up, he sent Jesus to right our religious wrongs. Honestly if you want a good insight to the Catholic faith mixed with a bit of humor watch Dogma, they did their homework on that _______________ Ω Allehelgens Død Helveds Rike Ω This comment was edited by Sauron-the-rasta-mon on Feb 24 2005 03:10pm. |
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Doran - Student 
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Had a great bible study tonight. We are in a 3 month class on financial management, and the Bible's word on finances. Over 2300 references to finances in the Bible! Our verse to memorize this week was in regards to counsel: Proverbs: 12:15 "The way of a fool is right to him, but a wise man listens to advice." (NIV) The fellowship and sharing has been fantastic. Praise God! |
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Koyi Donita - Student
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I agree with Smily here and I would just like to add that the scriptures tell us: In Colossians 2:8 & 9 we read: 8) Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. 9) For in him dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. Also in Luke 23:33 & 34 we read: 33) And when they were come to the place, which is called Calvary, there they crucified him, and the malefactors, one on the right hand, and the other on the left. 34) Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots. With these two verses in mind it is my belief that Jesus being the fullness of the Godhead bodily and asking for some type of mercy toward the people who crucified Him may not, (I'm not saying will not), hold them accountable for the events that took place that day. Those things were prophicied about for hundreds, maybe thousands of years before they actually happened and they had to happen in order to fulfill the scriptures. These individuals will still be held accountable for the rest of there lives, but Jesus asking for their forgiveness shows me that those people had to do those things and may not have drawn any greater degree of wrath upon themselves by doing them. The remaining sin before and after the crucifixion would still be accountable unless they became saved which the Bible gives no evidance of as far as I know. _______________ For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. Rom. 1:16 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom. 10:17 I love my babyface. Smilykrazy is my baby and I love her. ...Swimming through the void we hear the Word, we lose ourselves but we find it all... System Of A Down.
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Smilykrazy - Retired 
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Ya we did execute Jesus Christ, the son of God. But from my reading and understanding, Jesus came into the world to pay for the sins of his people. He gave his life so that we may live eternally. I believe that if the people that did execute Jesus were sinners and were not true believers and or some of Gods chosen people, then yes they will suffer Gods anger and rage in hell. But for all of humanity to suffer because of those actions, I dont think is true. Everyone is responsible for their own actions and I understand that God will treat everyone accordingly. Just my ideas and understanding _______________ RIP MOM 06/29/58-07/31/08 Married to Koyi Donita 4/30/11 |
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Bail Hope of Belouve - Student 
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Quote: Hmm, If God can do whatever he wants, and change anything he wants in a shorter time than one-one millionth of a nano-second wouldn't he end all suffering? Sorry to jump back a bit, but I saw this, and it reminded me of a discussion a bit earlier. Someone in the discussion literally said: "Ah, but who says God hasn't stopped caring after we killed his son?" Generally, that's a good question. Jesus may have risen from the grave, but still, we executed someone who brought us a message of love. I think we can/could expect a certain form of anger for this, in any case. What are your thoughts about it, people? _______________ Visit the Belouve Family Website! Quote: I try to have fun with my friends and try to make a difference as best I can. What does making a difference mean? Well, it can be as simple as saying hello, answering a question that seems obvious or heck, just talking. -- Vladarion
Want to know Vladarion? Read the Article about his life here. |
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Koyi Donita - Student
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Okay, just a quick comment without any scripture. I read through the track about death that the Jehova's gave me and I read some of what was posted below, (please forgive me for I am very busy ). Basically, from what I gather from what I read, they believe that once the body dies the soul dies too. I'll post more later, but the track specifically states, "No where is it ever said in the Bible that God gave man an eternal soul". The scriptures that were offered up tried to support this idea and pointed to the resurrection as to what we should look forward to for our new life. I hate to call on people, but since scripture was offered up earlier in this thread I was just wondering if this belief is held by your too CynGuard? I'll read up some more and collect my thoughts and we'll discuss this further in a little bit. Thank you ahead of time for your participation. _______________ For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. Rom. 1:16 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom. 10:17 I love my babyface. Smilykrazy is my baby and I love her. ...Swimming through the void we hear the Word, we lose ourselves but we find it all... System Of A Down.
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WingZero - Student |
People refuse to think that and want to blame God for what has happenned throughout the years since the time of David and beyond. _______________ "I'm on a highway to hell, but on the highway i see a stairway to heaven. The i felt like knockin' on heaven's door, now Jesus is taking me down to the Paradise City" -WingZer0 "She asked,'Do you feel alright?' and i said ' Yeah I feel wonderful tonight'" -"Wonderful Tonight" by Eric Clapton |
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Plo, the general idea is that God gave us free will, because He wanted us to learn to create a peaceful, happy world for ourselves, and not have it handed to us. Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Teach a man how to catch a fish, and he eats for a lifetime. I agree that there are attrocities in this world that can't be considered anything less than horrendous, but if it is indeed the will of God, who are we to argue? It's up to us as human beings to do everything in our power to prevent such things happening. Unfortunately, there ARE evil people in the world, but one day, we'll learn. Perhaps not in our lifetime, or the lifetime of our children, or grandchildren, but we will eventually learn. |
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Plo Koon - Student 
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So if its about original sin, what did those three to seven year old russian children do to have terrorists storm their school, see their own teachers get shot up close, be held hostage for many days at gun point and be literally starved to death? Did they steal some cookies from the jar above the cupboard? _______________ Free Tibet! Click this link,and learn Here too This comment was edited by Plo Koon on Feb 12 2005 03:10pm. |
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Sauron-the-rasta-mon - Student 
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Plo, I see where you are coming from. I do this because I have pondered that question (or questions I guess) myself. I'm not saying that I don't believe in God, I'm only saying that I too have questioned my faith in such a way. Though I have never asked the question and therefor do not have a direct answer from my church (the Catholic church) I can still give you my opinion. It involves original sin. God loves us yes, but he is a father and therefor he must punish his children. That may sound sick but it's not meant to. He must punish us, even if we do ask for forgiveness. I really can't think of what else to add or elaborate on that thought because in my own mind it sounds flawed. I guess I should think on it some more. This is purely opinion. _______________ Ω Allehelgens Død Helveds Rike Ω This comment was edited by Sauron-the-rasta-mon on Feb 12 2005 02:47pm. |
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Plo Koon - Student
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Hmm, If God can do whatever he wants, and change anything he wants in a shorter time than one-one millionth of a nano-second wouldn't he end all suffering? I know that you would all say he has left us free will and I have heard many, many, many times the argumant of free will but... I'd rather not believe in a God than a God that just sits and watches as the Haulocost, World War I, World War II, 10,000 deaths every few weeks in the Congo, Sudan, and all the horrid stuff that I really don't want to remember goes on. If there is a God that could do anything and everything, whenever He wanted, wherever He wanted don't you think he'd intervene and let Human Beings flourish til' an old age instead of millions and millions and millions of young and old deaths happen un-needlessly? _______________ Free Tibet! Click this link,and learn Here too This comment was edited by Plo Koon on Feb 12 2005 01:09pm. |
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Koyi Donita - Student
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In 1 Chronicles 29: 11 & 12 we read: 11) Yours, O LORD, is the greatness, The power and the glory, The victory and the majesty; For all that is in heaven and in earth is Yours; Yours is the kingdom, O LORD, And You are exalted as head over all. 12) Both riches and honor come from You, And You reign over all. In Your hand is power and might; In Your hand it is to make great And to give strength to all. Very nice scripture. Thank you for sharing that with us. _______________ For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. Rom. 1:16 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom. 10:17 I love my babyface. Smilykrazy is my baby and I love her. ...Swimming through the void we hear the Word, we lose ourselves but we find it all... System Of A Down.
This comment was edited by Koyi Donita on Feb 12 2005 06:23am. |
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Doran - Student 
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I really like 1 Chronicles 29: 11-12. Puts things in perspective for me. (NIV version). |
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Koyi Donita - Student
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That is an interesting post Jeremia. I hope you don't mind me picking your brain, but I was wondering what you meant by that statement. Is that actual scripture? It sounds awefully familiar like I've read it before. _______________ For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. Rom. 1:16 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom. 10:17 I love my babyface. Smilykrazy is my baby and I love her. ...Swimming through the void we hear the Word, we lose ourselves but we find it all... System Of A Down.
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Jeramia Adept - Student 
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Lord Christ taught us many things, the most wonderous was love, without it the world would remain in chaos _______________ The Force is my ally, and a powerful ally it is. Padawan Brother to Darth Sirius |
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Koyi Donita - Student
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Man, I've been busy as of late and I just wanted to let you know that I printed out your post to read if and when I got a moment. Looks good and thank you for participating in our study. I'll share some of the scriptures the track has on it with their beliefs to see if they square up with what yours are and maybe some of my own. Then we can start to search for truth. _______________ For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. Rom. 1:16 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom. 10:17 I love my babyface. Smilykrazy is my baby and I love her. ...Swimming through the void we hear the Word, we lose ourselves but we find it all... System Of A Down.
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CynGuard - Student 
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Published by Jehovah's Witnesses: (I am one  )DEATH The cessation of all functions of life, hence, the opposite of life. (De 30:15, 19) In the Bible the same original-language words for “death” or “dying” are applied to humans, animals, and plants. (Ec 3:19; 9:5; Joh 12:24; Jude 12; Re 16:3) However, for humans and animals the Bible shows the vital function of the blood in maintaining life, stating that “the soul of the flesh is in the blood.” (Le 17:11, 14; Ge 4:8-11; 9:3, 4) Both humans and animals are spoken of as ‘expiring,’ that is, ‘breathing out’ the breath of life (Heb., nish·math´ chai·yim´). (Ge 7:21, 22; compare Ge 2:7.) And the Scriptures show that death in humans and animals follows the loss of the spirit (active force) of life (Heb., ru´ach chai·yim´).—Ge 6:17, ftn; 7:15, 22; Ec 3:19; see SPIRIT. From the Biblical viewpoint, what is death? It is of interest to note the correspondency of these Biblical points with what is known scientifically of the death process. In humans, for example, when the heart stops beating, the blood ceases to circulate nourishment and oxygen (obtained by breathing) to the billions of body cells. However, The World Book Encyclopedia (1987, Vol. 5, p. 52b) pointed out: “A person whose heart and lungs stop working may be considered clinically dead, but somatic death may not yet have occurred. The individual cells of the body continue to live for several minutes. The person may be revived if the heart and lungs start working again and give the cells the oxygen they need. After about three minutes, the brain cells—which are most sensitive to a lack of oxygen—begin to die. The person is soon dead beyond any possibility of revival. Gradually, other cells of the body also die. The last ones to perish are the bone, hair, and skin cells, which may continue to grow for several hours.” Thus while the vital importance of breathing and of the blood in maintaining the active life-force (ru´ach chai·yim´) in the body cells is evident, at the same time it is also clear that it is not the cessation of breathing or of heartbeat alone but the disappearance of the life-force or spirit from the body cells that brings death as referred to in the Scriptures.—Ps 104:29; 146:4; Ec 8:8. Cause of Death in Humans. The first reference to death in the Scriptures occurs at Genesis 2:16, 17 in God’s command to the first man concerning the eating from the tree of the knowledge of good and bad, violation of which command would result in death. (See NW ftn.) However, death among animals as a natural process was evidently already in effect, since they are passed over completely in the Biblical presentation of the introduction of death into the human family. (Compare 2Pe 2:12.) The gravity of God’s warning about the death penalty for disobedience would therefore be understandable to his human son, Adam. Adam’s disobedience to his Creator brought death to him. (Ge 3:19; Jas 1:14, 15) Thereafter, Adam’s sin and its consequence, death, spread to all men.—Ro 5:12; 6:23. Certain texts are, at times, brought forth as supposed evidence that physical death was intended as a natural eventuality for humans, even as for the animals; for example, the references to man’s life span as being ‘seventy or eighty years’ (Ps 90:10) and the apostle’s statement that “it is reserved for men to die once for all time, but after this a judgment.” (Heb 9:27) Nevertheless, all such texts were written after the introduction of death among mankind, and are applied to imperfect, sinful humans. The tremendous longevity of the men living prior to the Flood must at least be considered as reflecting a remarkable potential in the human body, surpassing that found in any animal even under the most ideal conditions. (Ge 5:1-31) The Bible unmistakably relates the entrance of death into the human family to Adam’s sin, as already shown. Alienated from God by sin, mankind in general is said to be in “enslavement to corruption.” (Ro 8:21) This enslavement is due to the workings of sin in their bodies, bringing forth its corrupting fruit, and all persons not obedient to God are under the rule of sin as its slaves “with death in view.” (Ro 6:12, 16, 19-21) Satan is stated to have “the means to cause death.” (Heb 2:14, 15) He is called “a manslayer” (Joh 8:44), not necessarily because he kills directly but because he does so by deceit and seduction to sin, by inducing or stimulating wrongdoing that leads to corruption and death (2Co 11:3), and also by fathering murderous attitudes in the minds and hearts of men. (Joh 8:40-44, 59; 13:2; compare Jas 3:14-16; 4:1, 2.) Death is therefore presented, not as the friend of man, but as man’s “enemy.” (1Co 15:26) It is generally those in extreme or unbearable pain who are shown as desiring death.—Job 3:21, 22; 7:15; Re 9:6. Condition of Human Dead. The dead are shown to be “conscious of nothing at all” and the death state to be one of complete inactivity. (Ec 9:5, 10; Ps 146:4) Those dying are described as going into “the dust of death” (Ps 22:15), becoming “impotent in death.” (Pr 2:18; Isa 26:14) In death there is no mention of God or any praising of him. (Ps 6:5; Isa 38:18, 19) In both the Hebrew and the Greek Scriptures, death is likened to sleep, a fitting comparison not only because of the unconscious condition of the dead but also because of the hope of an awakening through the resurrection. (Ps 13:3; Joh 11:11-14) The resurrected Jesus is spoken of as “the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep in death.”—1Co 15:20, 21; see HADES; SHEOL. Whereas the ancient Egyptians and other peoples of pagan nations, and particularly the Grecian philosophers, were strong in their belief in the deathlessness of the human soul, both the Hebrew Scriptures and the Christian Greek Scriptures speak of the soul (Heb., ne´phesh; Gr., psy·khe´) as dying (Jg 16:30; Eze 18:4, 20; Re 16:3), needing deliverance from death (Jos 2:13; Ps 33:19; 56:13; 116:8; Jas 5:20), or as in the Messianic prophecy concerning Jesus Christ, being “poured out . . . to the very death” (Isa 53:12; compare Mt 26:38). The prophet Ezekiel condemns those who connived “to put to death the souls that ought not to die” and “to preserve alive the souls that ought not to live.”—Eze 13:19; see SOUL. Thus, The Interpreter’s Bible (Vol. II, p. 1015), commenting on 1 Samuel 25:29, observes that “the idea of man as consisting of body and soul which are separated at death is not Hebrew but Greek.” (Edited by G. Buttrick, 1953) Similarly, Edmond Jacob, Professor of Old Testament at the University of Strasbourg, points out that, since in the Hebrew Scriptures one’s life is directly related with the soul (Heb., ne´phesh), “it is natural that death should sometimes be represented as the disappearance of this nephesh (Gen. 35:18; I Kings 17:21; Jer. 15:9; Jonah 4:3). The ‘departure’ of the nephesh must be viewed as a figure of speech, for it does not continue to exist independently of the body, but dies with it (Num. 31:19; Judg. 16:30; Ezek. 13:19). No biblical text authorizes the statement that the ‘soul’ is separated from the body at the moment of death.”—The Interpreter’s Dictionary of the Bible, edited by G. Buttrick, 1962, Vol. 1, p. 802. Redemption From Condemnation of Death. Psalm 68:20 states: “To Jehovah the Sovereign Lord belong the ways out from death.” By means of the sacrifice of his human life, Christ Jesus became God’s “Chief Agent” of life and salvation (Ac 3:15; Heb 2:10), and through him the abolishing of death is assured. (2Ti 1:10) By suffering death, Jesus ‘tasted death for every man’ and provided “a corresponding ransom for all.” (Heb 2:9; 1Ti 2:6) By means of Jesus’ “one act of justification,” a cancellation of the condemnation of death that sin brings now became possible, so that men of all sorts might enjoy “a declaring of them righteous for life.” (Ro 5:15, 16, 18, 19; Heb 9:27, 28; see DECLARE RIGHTEOUS; RANSOM.) Thus, concerning Jesus’ true followers, it could be said that they had, in effect, “passed over from death to life.” (Joh 5:24) Those disobeying the Son and not exercising love, however, ‘remain in death’ and under God’s condemnation. (1Jo 3:14; Joh 3:36) Those who want to be free from condemnation and free from “the law of sin and of death” must be guided by God’s spirit and produce its fruits, for “the minding of the [sinful] flesh means death.”—Ro 8:1-6; Col 1:21-23. Jesus’ sacrificial course, terminating in his death and resurrection, was likened by him to baptism. (Mr 10:38, 39; Lu 12:50; compare Eph 4:9, 10.) The apostle Paul showed that Jesus’ anointed followers also would go through a similar baptism into death, their resurrection to heavenly glory ensuing. (Ro 6:3-5; Php 3:10, 11) In expressing his earnest desire to take up heavenly life, Paul showed that it was not death itself that was wanted by spirit-begotten Christians, nor to lie “naked” in death, but the ‘putting on’ of a heavenly body in order to be at “home with the Lord.” (2Co 5:1-8; compare 2Pe 1:13-15.) In the meantime, death “is at work” in them, while, by their ministry, they bring a message of life to those to whom they minister.—2Co 4:10-14; Pr 18:21; see BAPTISM (Baptism Into Christ Jesus, Into His Death). Those who benefit from that ministry include the great crowd that have the prospect of surviving the great tribulation and enjoying eternal life on a paradise earth. Because of their faith in the sin-atoning value of Jesus’ sacrifice, they, too, come to have a clean standing before God.—1Jo 2:2; Re 7:9, 14. Jesus speaks of himself as having “the keys of death and of Hades” (Re 1:18), and he uses these in releasing those held by death. (Joh 5:28, 29; Re 20:13) Jehovah God’s release of Jesus from Hades serves as a “guarantee to all men” of God’s future day of judgment or reckoning and provides assurance that there will be a resurrection of those in Hades. (Ac 17:31; 1Co 15:20, 21) Those inheriting God’s Kingdom in immortality are described as triumphing over death in their resurrection, so that its “sting” is overcome.—1Co 15:50, 54-56; compare Ho 13:14; Re 20:6. The Destruction of Death. At Isaiah 25:8 the prophetic promise is made that God “will actually swallow up death forever, and the Sovereign Lord Jehovah will certainly wipe the tears from all faces.” The sting producing death is sin (1Co 15:56), and thus all having sin and its accompanying imperfection have death working in their bodies. (Ro 7:13, 23, 24) The abolition of death, therefore, would require the abolition of that which produces death: sin. By the removal of the last trace of sin from obedient mankind, the authority of death will be abolished and death itself will be destroyed, and this is to be accomplished during the reign of Christ. (1Co 15:24-26) Thereby death, brought upon the human race by Adam’s transgression, “will be no more.” (Ro 5:12; Re 21:3, 4) Its destruction is figuratively likened to its being hurled into a “lake of fire.”—Re 20:14; see LAKE OF FIRE. Second Death. “The lake of fire” into which death, Hades, the symbolic “wild beast” and “the false prophet,” Satan, his demons, and the persistent practicers of wickedness on earth are cast is shown to mean “the second death.” (Re 20:10, 14, 15; 21:8; Mt 25:41) Initially death resulted from and was passed on to mankind as a result of Adam’s transgression; hence “the second death” must be distinct from this inherited death. It is evident from the cited texts that there is no release possible from “the second death.” The situation of those in “the second death” corresponds to the outcome warned of in such texts as Hebrews 6:4-8; 10:26, 27; and Matthew 12:32. On the other hand, those represented as gaining “the crown of life” and having part in “the first resurrection” are free from any possibility of harm by the second death. (Re 2:10, 11) These, who are to reign with Christ, receive immortality (deathlessness) and incorruption and hence are beyond the “authority” of the second death.—1Co 15:50-54; Re 20:6; compare Joh 8:51. Illustrative Use. Death is personified as a “king” ruling over mankind from the time of Adam (Ro 5:14), along with the rule of King Sin. (Ro 6:12) Thus, these kings are spoken of as exercising their “law” over those subject to their dominion. (Ro 8:2) With Christ’s coming and the provision of the ransom, undeserved kindness began exercising a superior kingship over those accepting God’s gift, “with everlasting life in view.”—Ro 5:15-17, 21. Though men, disregarding God’s purposes, may try to make their own pact or covenant with King Death, it will fail. (Isa 28:15, 18) Like a horseman riding behind war and famine, death is pictured as bringing mass mortality to earth’s inhabitants.—Re 6:8; compare Jer 9:21, 22. Those spiritually sick or distressed are described as “arriving at the gates of death” (Ps 107:17-20; compare Job 38:17; Ps 9:13), and those passing through such “gates” enter the figurative “house of meeting for everyone living” (Job 30:23; compare 2Sa 12:21-23), with its “interior rooms” (Pr 7:27) and a capacity for victims that is never completely filled. (Hab 2:5) Those going into Sheol are like sheep shepherded by death.—Ps 49:14. “The pangs of death.” At Acts 2:24 the apostle Peter spoke of Jesus as being ‘loosed from the pangs of death, for it was not possible for him to continue to be held fast by it.’ The Greek word (o·din´) here translated “pangs” is elsewhere used to mean the pains of childbirth (1Th 5:3) but may also mean travail, pain, calamity, or distress generally. (Mt 24:8) Additionally, it was used by the translators of the Greek Septuagint in rendering the Hebrew word che´vel in texts where the evident meaning is “rope.” (2Sa 22:6; Ps 18:4, 5) A related Hebrew word means “birth pangs,” leading some commentators and lexicographers to suggest that the Greek term (o·din´) used by Luke at Acts 2:24 also had this double meaning, at least in Hellenistic Greek of apostolic times. Thus some translations render the phrase in this verse as “the bands [or bonds] of death.” (NC [Spanish]; Segond, Ostervald [French]) In numerous texts the danger of death is represented as reaching out to snare the threatened one (Pr 13:14; 14:27) with ropes that encircle him and bring him down into “the distressing circumstances of Sheol.” (Ps 116:3) Whereas other texts, already considered, show that there is no consciousness in death, and it is obvious that Jesus was not in any literal pain while dead, nonetheless death is presented as a bitter and distressing experience (1Sa 15:32; Ps 55:4; Ec 7:26) not only in the pain usually preceding it (Ps 73:4, 5) but in the loss of all activity and freedom that its paralyzing grip brings. So, it may be that it is in this sense that Jesus’ resurrection ‘loosed’ him from “the pangs of death,” freeing him from its distressing grip. Change in spiritual state or condition. The death state is used to illustrate the spiritually dead condition of the world in general, so Jesus could speak of ‘the dead burying the dead,’ and the apostle Paul could refer to the woman living for sensual gratification as “dead though she is living.” (Lu 9:60; 1Ti 5:6; Eph 2:1) And since physical death discharges one from any debts or obligations existing up to that time (Ro 6:7), a Christian’s being freed or liberated from sin (Ro 6:2, 11) and from the condemnation of the Mosaic Law (Ro 7:2-6) is also likened to death, such one having ‘died’ to his former situation and obligations. The one figuratively dying in such a way, of course, is still alive physically and is now free to follow Christ as a slave to righteousness.—Ro 6:18-20; Ga 5:1. The use of death to represent a change in one’s state or condition throws light on prophetic visions, such as that in the book of Ezekiel wherein God’s people in exile in Babylon are likened to dried-out bones and to persons dead and buried. (Eze 37:1-12) They were to “come to life” again and be settled on their own soil once more. (Eze 37:13, 14) Comparable illustrations are found at Revelation 11:3, 7-12 and Luke 16:19-31. _______________ http://www.jfsf.com/JF |
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