| Exploits (no flaming :D) | |
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Jake Kainite - Student  |
First off, as I said no flaming please, or the thread will just be closed down. This is just for your personal opinions of 'exploits' and I really just want a clarification of the rules. My opinion: Basically if you can do it, I don't consider it wrong. This includes scripting (yes I know its against JA rules, doesn't make it wrong though  )What is the JA's standing on exploits? I read in a the intagib thread about strafe jumping being an exploit, which I spose technically is very true. However what about things such as throw pulling, swaying (or whatever it was). _______________ Apprenctice of Jedi Master Ascari (deceased) Descended from a line of great Jedi Will argue any point of view from any side |
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Permanent:
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Aron - Retired 
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Thread bans: None yet. Let's keep it that way! |
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Furi0us - Student 
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I would like to apologise to everyone. My comment should not have been so harsh. Again, sorry. _______________ You are not your f***ing system specs. You are not your uptime stats, your script file, or your oversized desktop screencap. You are not your broadband connection. You are not your f***ing post count. |
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Jake Kainite - Student 
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you guys got my thread given an asbo (anti social behaviour order) why!!! *runs off and cries* _______________ Apprenctice of Jedi Master Ascari (deceased) Descended from a line of great Jedi Will argue any point of view from any side
This comment was edited by Jake Kainite on May 26 2005 02:13pm. |
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Wolfwood - Student 
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Hehe Ozz. Thanks for mentioning my Push/Pull techniques. And you are very right, it is defenately not an exploit. Pulling/pushing all depends on which angles you choose to pull or push from. For instance, if someone would walk on a straight surface, and you would run by him and try to push him into a pit, it is pretty sure nothing will happen. However, if you change your angle of attack (for instance, if you jump up and then push them) you have a much bigger chance of landing a succesfull push and pushing him into the pit. Same thing for pulling. If you pull someone who jumps up from very close, it probably won't do you any good as you will pull him onto the very ledge he jumped up from. However, if you change your angle in such a way that you are opposite of where you want your opponent to be pulled toward, then you will have a much better chance of pulling him straight where you wish to. Though this is very hard to describe without showing it to you so, if anyone wants to learn this feel free to ask me on my profile and we can set a time, or just ask me while I am on the servers  _______________ ~ Honor is a fool's prize. Glory is of no use to the dead ~ This comment was edited by Wolfwood on May 26 2005 11:13am. |
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Kainz00r - Jedi Knight 
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Um, my last comment wasn't meant to sound aggressive at all, but it could be taken as aggressively so... yeah. I understand my situation, and will refrain from posting in this thread onwards, as there is such a conflict in certain opinions it'll lead me to make posts which Furious <3's. Good luck with the discussion though, i'll be keeping a keen eye over it, however on a final note here's what I have to say on this: Right or wrong, exploiters will always be here. They are in abundance now, and ever-growing. There is nothing we can do to stop it, but the best we can do is keep -this- community clean. You can try to best them using legitimate tactics, but when they beat you with their exploits which is the probable outcome, over and over again, it will likely lead to frustration. I speak from the Master of all, experience. gl hf! _______________ Fervent supporter of duelling - leave a message if you would like to battle! Married to Masta. This comment was edited by Kainz00r on May 26 2005 11:08am. |
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Aron - Retired
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Alright, let's make something clear. As you have probably noticed, I added a permanent comment on this thread. This threadbans post will most likely be posted on other threads too if needed. Before you are added to it, you will receive a warning. If you act like a jerk after that, your name will be added to the list, meaning you are UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES allowed to post on the specific thread. FAILURE TO DO SO WILL RESULT IN AN ACCOUNT DEACTIVATION!! Kain, here's your first and last warning. Keep it nice or stay out. Furious, I can understand you get agitated, but please try to hold back too. |
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Odan-Wei Belouve - Student 
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I agree with Masta, Fur, keep it cool. Kain, I suggest you read your posts several time before you post them, this way you'll have the time to ask yourself if you would enjoy to have similar posts aimed at you. So far, you're the only aggressive person in this thread, the only one starting flames, don't you feel lonely ? We're all here to share opinions and experience, not to punch each other. If you can't express your opinion without anger/aggressivity, better not post. My €0.02 (€>>>$ !!!  ) Odan-Wei _______________ Padawan and brother to SmilyKrazy - Adopted in the Belouve Family by Fizz and Bubu, BELOUVE ON! - Vladarion, you'll always be in my heart and memories - Spam-Padawan of Jacen Aratan  - [DJ is my beloved wife! - JA Family: Brothers:
Virtue, Furi0us, Vladarion, Hardwired, Janus, Axion, D@RtHM@UL, Motrec, Mike , xAnAtOs , Luke Skywalker; Little bro to SilkMonkey ; Special kind of brother to Kenyon ; Sisters in-law: Rosered, Ain-Soph Aur] Photoshop works: click here |
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Masta - Jedi Council 
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That was really unnecessary Furious and will cause even more tension. But anyway, yes i think all this exploiting business can be compared to SW a bit.The easier, quicker path to power which doesnt depend on discipline nor peace of mind, sounds pretty much like the dark side to me.Thing is though, Jedis dont complain about the dark side beeing cheap and so on...they actually try to convert dark siders. _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. This comment was edited by Masta on May 26 2005 09:30am. |
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Furi0us - Student 
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Kain, your negative posts are starting to piss me off. If you have nothing nice to say, do not say it. - Fur. _______________ You are not your f***ing system specs. You are not your uptime stats, your script file, or your oversized desktop screencap. You are not your broadband connection. You are not your f***ing post count. |
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Italian Ice - Student 
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lol no flameing intended by this, but we talk about exploiting like its a battle between good and evil _______________ It's funny how many people know they have the right to remain silent, yet never do. |
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Gradius - Ex-Student 
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Quote: Just came up with a new idea as well. I will show gradius these exploits, teach them too him, teach him how to beat them by using them against him or any JAK+ then have that person teach a class on beating exploits. Sound good? hopeso. Also for those exploiters who want to know how to counter the counter I think its only fair for you to ask me how to beat those things.... but.... Trust me, all JAK+ are well aware of every exploit in the game, and we do our best to teach people how to avoid them. Most of them just take time and practice. Best thing to do is go find some exploiters and duel them until you learn to beat each one. The thing is, alot like any style, people who exploit are unique from one another. You can be taught how to defend yourself against each one, but the best of exploiters use them without notice and make them happen instantly. Not a whole lot you can do about that except not duel these people. *Sigh* I remember the good old days when exploiters weren't a problem, and people didn't use them as often. It's a shame we have to resort ourselves to fighting these people. _______________ - Proud padawan of Kueller. - We really are at the beginning of it all. The trick, of course, is to make sure we never find the end. - Bill Bryson, A Short History of Nearly Everything - <gen-e-sis-happy> Liek, you can train, liek, a n00b, but he'll just be a trained n00b... --> Wise words! - "daer SOE me likes your a company i am having your some money for letting me do stuff cos mes the best amd i do it all meself" - Slider |
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Balian - Ex-Student |
Well Kain it depends on what your majority is. No I do not win everyduel there is out there given fact. But if i win 5 outa 9 do you consider that majority? My statement was I beat exploiters all the time never said which exploits. Not like im fighting the greatest exploiters in the game everytime or anything just people who do any exploit. Anyways tell me your guys'z thoughts on what I put itd be easier to show you so if you see me ask. P.S. I dont go to the euro servers either so im sure the exploiters im playing are weaker then the ones your playing. Just thought of that. GOOOO GERMANY! -inventors of the SPIN!- _______________ What man is a man who does not make the world better. This comment was edited by Balian on May 26 2005 12:21am. |
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Balian - Ex-Student |
Alrighty then being an ex-exploiter I can see how people manuever around my old exploitin ways so here goes. First off you must remember its not always wise to throw yourself right at someone from the start cause you may have no idea what your running in to. Head first into a spinner or poker = certain death. Lets face it your not Rocky in the Rocky II-V movies where he quits technique and goes straight to leading with his head. Now Spinners and pokers my favorite to kill. One thing I see least of at the JA is people using Diagnols. That is how you beat spinners and pokers with the right diagnol of red or yellow. Now the manuevering is hard to explain, if its a right swing u need to run as far right as u can and just before thier swing ends is when u need to be hitting them as they run cause thier spin shield is down(haha). I believe not stopwatched but the red swing is 2, 2 1/2 seconds with the combo its about 1 and a half. depending on your counting not official stopwatch. Or because a poke is so difficult to see ur enemy at the end half of the swing you can quickly change directions of your attack and they are completely open. But the main way to win is my ever favorite FOOTWORK. The most important part of dueling. Now lets see swayers, well all u need is a well timed diagnol combo between swing with a backflip stops thier sweep mid heat or you can do what i do use the KATA. LOL sweeps are so telegraphed just look for a person running with just left strafe being held its that obvious to see guys! Ask someoen in the server to run around you with just left strafe held and get an eye for it. Hide and Gliders, very simple tactic. use once again the diagnols or stay away and hit at the second combo swing. BTW the glide swing never ever ghosts and if both people swing at the same time it most likely wins. Ok I guess that is all for now. Hopefully I didnt sound like a cocky jerk or like I am Billy Badarse or something just how I come across sometimes not sure why... Just came up with a new idea as well. I will show gradius these exploits, teach them too him, teach him how to beat them by using them against him or any JAK+ then have that person teach a class on beating exploits. Sound good? hopeso. Also for those exploiters who want to know how to counter the counter I think its only fair for you to ask me how to beat those things.... but.... But im not tellin! HAHA <3 Da gradius! _______________ What man is a man who does not make the world better. This comment was edited by Balian on May 26 2005 12:14am. |
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solitude - Jedi Council 
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Quote: I bet you my pen... arm you can't beat them all the majority of the time, Deq. i also bets kains other arm _______________ Joined 16 October 2004 | Retired 10 April 2005 | Returned 05 June 2008 | Made Staff 27 June 2008 | Made Council 18 January 2009 Padawan To Odan-Wei Belouve | Adopted into the Belouve family | Twin to xAnAtOs | Owner of the 4th Quesi sexy badge Brother To Roan Belouve, Nomad, Majno, Silkmonkey, Kensei and Jarhok Belouve
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Kainz00r - Jedi Knight
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I bet you my pen... arm you can't beat them all the majority of the time, Deq. _______________ Fervent supporter of duelling - leave a message if you would like to battle! Married to Masta. |
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solitude - Jedi Council
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Quote: um i beat pokers all the time. You wana know how? Ask me in the server. I beat swayers all the time, you wanna know how? Ask me in the servers. I beat exploiters all the time without exploiting. You wanna know how?, ask me in the server. <3 da gradius im sure you do beat some pokers i would however appereciate you trying to explain this technique for beating all these 'exploits' in the thread for those who cant find you on servers like masta said..however, my points wasnt that it isnt possible to beat 'exploiters', only that 'exploiting' gives people a significant advantage _______________ Joined 16 October 2004 | Retired 10 April 2005 | Returned 05 June 2008 | Made Staff 27 June 2008 | Made Council 18 January 2009 Padawan To Odan-Wei Belouve | Adopted into the Belouve family | Twin to xAnAtOs | Owner of the 4th Quesi sexy badge Brother To Roan Belouve, Nomad, Majno, Silkmonkey, Kensei and Jarhok Belouve
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Katan - Student 
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Quote: people are WAYYYY to tight up, people are finding new ways to do damage all the time. and i have heard even on the JA that these things are exploiting (this is also what master jisted at) they aint, they are new styles developing and tbh, u guys are slightly digging ur own grave, while u whine about poking and exploiting some of you are also digging ur grave abotu stopping people from finding new ways to play the game. people will make new styles and u people will complain, IMO if i dont see it as exploiting, its MY STYLE if you dont like it its your opinions which people have rights to explain. Certain exploits are worse than others. Yay for contradictory statements.. In one statement, you talk about how we all complain that these "new styles developing" shouldnt be called expoilts, and then in your next statement you yourself call them exploits, and say how some are worse than others. Take your pick. You also said we are trying to stop people from "developing new styles" When did we try and do that? Stating opinions is not forcing will upon others I dont mean to offend you or anything man, but your post (in places) came off as "I'm right and your wrong" and "Its only exploiting if I'm not using it" Again, didn't mean to insult.. _______________ |
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Squibit - Student 
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I second that masta please explain here deq _______________ Quote: fiZZe: its SIR Fizzy Fluffy :p Quote: FiZZ[JAK]: that was what I call a counter Ah, things you only ever expect to hear once
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Masta - Jedi Council 
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Let me be the first one to congratulate you on beeing so successful in beating anysort of players. Also, im very sure that a lot of ppl who read this thread would be very interested in your way of beating these exploiters.So, please try to explain it with your words, since not everyone will be able to get ahold of you on the servers. =/ _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
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Balian - Ex-Student |
um i beat pokers all the time. You wana know how? Ask me in the server. I beat swayers all the time, you wanna know how? Ask me in the servers. I beat exploiters all the time without exploiting. You wanna know how?, ask me in the server. <3 da gradius _______________ What man is a man who does not make the world better. |
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solitude - Jedi Council 
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Think of poking as duelling a guy who can instagib you in 1 hit. (while a poker can easily do). Now rethink your position a second and the ramifications of this. JKJA relies on attacking and countering. Now, lets say you are attacked. He needs a single hit, and you lose. He may get lucky, or he may aim skillfully, the fact of the matter is that 1 hit = game over. Now, lets say you decide to counter his attacks, again, all he needs is a single hit, anywhere and youre dead. In contrast, while a well placed red swing (for example) will do significant damage, it is unlikely to kill, especially if it hits, for example, a leg or arm. This means that if you hit him, he will be damaged, if he hits you, you die. This enables them to go on the offensive knowing that even if youre going to hit, theyre gonna hit you as well ( by pressing the atack recklessly for example). And they know if they hit, just once, they win the duel. _______________ Joined 16 October 2004 | Retired 10 April 2005 | Returned 05 June 2008 | Made Staff 27 June 2008 | Made Council 18 January 2009 Padawan To Odan-Wei Belouve | Adopted into the Belouve family | Twin to xAnAtOs | Owner of the 4th Quesi sexy badge Brother To Roan Belouve, Nomad, Majno, Silkmonkey, Kensei and Jarhok Belouve
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Kainz00r - Jedi Knight 
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I'm afraid Talion, that I have to disagree with what fragments of your mess I could comprehend. You say, "people will make new styles and u people will complain," which I have to disagree with. Poking is the technique to end all others in a non-force duel in jk3. We will -never- advance beyond it. There is no other technique more efficient than this one. The only way to beat it, is through timing of your own swings to hit them when they're not swinging. And no, that's not an evolvement... that's the damn basics of any fight. All in all, he's gona have the better moves... and your gona have to poke back to be on equal grounds. You will not find a more efficient technique than poking. _______________ Fervent supporter of duelling - leave a message if you would like to battle! Married to Masta. |
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Flux - Student 
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"Exploits" don't really bug me. To me, it's just a way the game is played, much like strafe-jumping became a part of Quake 3. They're not that hard to avoid, and even if someone using them keeps winning, it's not a big deal. Like n00b was saying, if it's that bothersome, just don't fight the guy. It's not worth it to get pissed off at someone that plays a certain way that you don't like. I play the game to have fun. I think the whole idea of "e-honor" and acting like a Jedi in a computer game is just plain silly, and it ruins the game when it's fretted over and emphasized all the time. _______________ When great gentlemens come together in a place. It could happen. All these gentlemen are Howard's family. Everybody knows them, but nobody knows. Why they come together.......... Just play cards. |
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NotSoLittleCaesar - Student 
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Quote: First of all, its enough if you post your comment once.You dont have to quote all of it again. Thing is, poking does require only a very tiny bit of skill.What actually IS important, is how much skilled you are in general.Poking wont make an extremly unexperienced player win all the time, but it will raise his chances to win a duel by a lot. Everything else has been said already so i wont repeat it. =) indeed sorry bout that _______________ Quote: I mostly agree oh Lord of the squeezy mop
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Masta - Jedi Council
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First of all, its enough if you post your comment once.You dont have to quote all of it again. Thing is, poking does require only a very tiny bit of skill.What actually IS important, is how much skilled you are in general.Poking wont make an extremly unexperienced player win all the time, but it will raise his chances to win a duel by a lot. Everything else has been said already so i wont repeat it. =) _______________ Find out more about the Jedi Academy Aurochs here and more about Masta here! Married to Kain. |
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NotSoLittleCaesar - Student
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Quote: after this uh..'squable' with ppl in this thread il state my full opinion: As master said about the history of tehe poke. all started in esl ect, Its another style. people who use it have often said 'i play for fun, relax its a game' and 'poking takes skill' nad yes. i full agree. Poking takes skill to master, like it or not its true. as has been mentioned u must learn how to impact a poke well. but the crap pokers simply wave there mouse round I have poked in the past, Badly and yes it was fun. and yes it took skill for me to master (well...to use effectivly) a person who randomly starts poking has no idea where the hell they are, thats why u must also know when to pace them so when u do them, u dont get fwaped in the face after when u have no idea where u are. The art of poking will be outdated IMo, as many have also said. people will find new tricks to counter poking aswell as they did for staffs. people are WAYYYY to tight up, people are finding new ways to do damage all the time. and i have heard even on the JA that these things are exploiting (this is also what master jisted at) they aint, they are new styles developing and tbh, u guys are slightly digging ur own grave, while u whine about poking and exploiting some of you are also digging ur grave abotu stopping people from finding new ways to play the game. people will make new styles and u people will complain, IMO if i dont see it as exploiting, its MY STYLE if you dont like it its your opinions which people have rights to explain. Certain exploits are worse than others. the other thing i hear is that 'light swaying' is like a uber h4x or 'sploiting, tbh i find it rediculous. u only hear this in the JA mega swaying, ye is bad, they insta, but the swaying i see in the ja (barely none or controlled) is doing a extra couple of damage like i said, i only hear complaining of this in the jA. Spining. now, this is a very wide subject. spinning 260, yes is bad, but is also passable (although yes.bad) two full rotations is v bad. ups damage up to insats (if i remember rightly) -tal-  _______________ Quote: I mostly agree oh Lord of the squeezy mop
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