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Pepsi - ex-Student |
I put a post on this on the bowing section as well, but I'd like to know what ppl that have grown tired of the Bowing discussion think as well, so here it goes.
What's more important? Getting good at playing this game, or being an 'honorable' jedi? Gun on! /Pepsi |
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Pepsi - Ex-Student |
Hehe. Way to go MoS. It's nice to see ppl find new interests within their old ones. It's a nice sign of selfawareness (or something, my psychology english fails me).
/Pepsi |
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MINDofSIN - Student 
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"Am I wrong about the paintball things, MoS?"
Sadly, for most of the games I play, you are. You will find the cheatingist sons a bitches you'll ever meet playing paintball. Some players have a nasty habit of playing on after they are shot, wiping paint, shooting refs to get them out of the way, etc. I play tournament paintball(speedball), not the same as rec(woods). When I'm just practicing or taking some of my relatives out to play, it is amazing how much people come together when forced to cooperate or get tagged out. I guess the sport brings out the best and worst in people. Check out www.warpig.com if you want to learn more about paintball. Anyways, you've already fallen asleep at your computer, so I'll move on. I've been playing more CTF and trying to use guns as much as I can. I've greatly improved by doing a few simple things differently. (Who really needs red stance in CTF when you can get better force powers?) I think that if we can get more people realizing how fun other game types can be, people will be more willing to learn how to play them. But if anyone wants to take my saber away, they'll have to pry it from my cold, dead fingers.  _______________ Jedi Academy Holocron http://jaholocron.ryanmh.com/ Why should our government send our soldiers to foreign soil to protect freedom of speech, when our freedom of speech is being taking away everyday by the same government. This comment was edited by MINDofSIN on Feb 20 2003 03:48pm. |
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ioshee - Student 
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Sorry Masterw. I didn't mean to lecture you Please forgive me. I love you man.
Pepsi, I'm not trying to patronize you, but your overall tone seems to be getting less abrasive. That’s cool man. Now people might be able to see your points without feeling rage and hate hehe  _______________ One of the Belouve boys |
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Pepsi - Ex-Student |
Archangel:
I AM trying with the saber, ok? The point I've been trying to make is that ppl should prove their worth with guns to get to teach guns. As it is now, everybody is duelling and learning duelling combos to advance in rank, but nowhere do they prove they can handle guns. I play JK2 because of force powers. The ability to jump 8 stories high is intriguing since it makes maps so much more fun than on regular FPS games. As for behaviour, I haven't insulted anyone for at least 10 posts (I'm running out of nails to chew on), so I'm trying in that department as well. It is, however, nice to hear somebody admit that there is a lack of knowledge about guns in the academy. You are the first person to say this aloud, and for that you've earned my respect. To accept the flaws in what we love, is to love it truly. I just would like to add proper use of guns and ctf tactics to the beauty of the academy, but pointing out that it is missing doesn't seem to be the popular thing to do. MINDofSIN (who btw earned my respect earlier): It's nice to know you know what I'm getting at, even though I don't think you thought the end of the thought. I'm sure that when you and your friends are done blasting each other all to hell, you congratulate each other, as well as the opposing team, on a well played game and compliment each other on nice shots and tell stories of "I was hiding in the bush under the tree, when...". This is the 'honorable' side of ctf, so to speak, and it's a shame most people here don't know about it, because it IS fun. Am I wrong about the paintball things, MoS? Gun on! /Pepsi |
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MINDofSIN - Student 
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"About teachers, maps, mods, scripts:
I'll take that as a joke, or your personal opinion. Mine differs quite a bit, and I'm sure many other ppls do as well, as always when it comes to "ours is the best" or "this owns that." I'm here for fun. If everyone here started to practice everything with the sole intent of being the best I would be out of here. I play this game to relax. I am on a tournament paintball team. We train hard to win, and we do. I understand where you're coming from, but we don't have the same goals as you either. You said you have access to a server. Fire it up in CTF, and get some Academy members on board. Jacen does CTF, mainly for fun, on Saturdays, go there and get people motivated too. _______________ Jedi Academy Holocron http://jaholocron.ryanmh.com/ Why should our government send our soldiers to foreign soil to protect freedom of speech, when our freedom of speech is being taking away everyday by the same government. |
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Archangel - Ex-Student 
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Pepsi, we have had trainers who were skilled with guns here in the past but, they also knew the saber. The saber isn't a hard thing to learn so why not pick it up and give it a shot if you feel so adamently about the academy needing a gun specialist to teach classes. If Acidic were still a JAT, or Damage were still around you would have your gun instructors but, they are not. So pick up that saber, learn the basic skills, and show some respect and you may be able to take their places. If you keep badmouthing people and being rude however, you will go no where here at the Jedi Academy. Like you said 'Truth hurts, right'. But simply that is the truth. This place does not tolerate, and most definately not encourage that kind of behavior.
Another thing, why play JK2 for guns. You can't tell me it has the best gun set up of the games out right now. If you want guns why not play Medal of Honor, or my personal favorite Urban Terror? They are much better gun focused games. The guns in this game are, how can I say, very lacking. None of them are that spectacular. Just curious with the side note. I honestly don't see why anyone would play this game just for the guns, when the saber is the innovative thing that this game has. It also has so much more depth and takes so much more practice to be good with than a simple gun. I'm sure I'll hear your response in a matter of minutes. See ya. _______________ A man asked me for a dollar, and I asked him what its for. He said "I have seen them". I said "ok its yours". |
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Pepsi - Ex-Student |
Insaniac:
My point is that to get to teach guns you should be tested to handle them. I was reading the FAQ on what's required for each level, and the only time guns are mentioned is when you're supposed to dodge them. The point I was making when asking how ppl would feel if they were taught duelling by me is that there are no guns trials what so ever, and teaching something requires knowing the subject at hand. This is not the case with the guns classes today. They are held by ppl who have proven they can execute special moves with sabers, protect a person in a saber fight, and engage in FF duels. The notion of a person who has never played with guns trying to teach them is as ridiculous as the idea of me teaching ppl how to duel. Nuff said (even I'm getting tired of repeating myself now). /Pepsi |
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Insaniac[JAP] - Ex-Student ![Insaniac[JAP]](/image_thumbnail.php?f_type=users&f_width=70&f_height=52&f_image=insaniac.jpg&f_odd=1)
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Pepsi, i must point out to you that everyone else seems to trake your posts as braggin or something, you ask how we would like to be taught saber skills by you, but the thing is, we are tested to prove that we are ready Not only to HANDLE a class, but that we know what we are talking about, the reason for the other ranks is to mae it easier on the few people that can do trials. _______________ Midbie Council Member #13 Padawan of SilkMonkey Stuntman extraordinaire |
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Pepsi - Ex-Student |
NFF (who devilishly posted while I was typing out the last comment):
Point taken, but I still don't understand why that prevents ppl that are good with using guns but suck with sabers from teaching guns classes, while the opposite is true. If I were to go to a guns class, I would like the teacher to be the most competent found in the academy on using them, since I'd be there to learn, and not to yawn and get upset since what is taught is way wrong. Let's turn things around and make my point obvious. How would you like to be taught how to duel by me? How would Luke Skywalker (the JAK, not the movie character) like to be taught how to duel by me? How would you and he like it if I was teaching you things that you, with your experience KNEW was wrong? Would you react and offer to help, or would you try owning me with guns first so you could change things later, when you finally would have attained rank enough to put an end to the madness of an idiot teaching you how to use the saber? (I'm not saying current guns instructors are idiots, well, not all of them, but that I'm an idiot when it comes to sabers). Cheers /Pepsi This comment was edited by Pepsi on Feb 20 2003 01:37pm. |
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Pepsi - Ex-Student |
Buzz:
I didn't have to. DJ_Sith asked me to email him my ideas so they can discuss it in the council. Something might happen, and yet again it may not. Whatever happens, I've sort of made my point anyways by opening the staff's eyes to a problem (again, meant in a nice way) I found within the academy. Shiya: I never said being a good person. I said 'honorable' jedi, which, in light of the academy's rules and traditions, shines differently in my eyes. About teachers, maps, mods, scripts: I'll take that as a joke, or your personal opinion. Mine differs quite a bit, and I'm sure many other ppls do as well, as always when it comes to "ours is the best" or "this owns that". The fact is that the academy today is suffering a severe lack when it comes to good instructors for guns based gametypes and any type of ctf. There are some, but many of the JAK's and JAT's don't play these gametypes, since they're more interested in duelling. You should read my last post on the 'Bowing' subject and you'll understand what I mean, without me having to repeat myself (once more). Cheers /Pepsi This comment was edited by Pepsi on Feb 20 2003 01:45pm. |
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NofrikinfuN - Retired 
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Pepsi, the reason sabers are the focus of the academy is this:
Every first-person shooter ever made has guns. None of them have sabers. That's not to say we won't teach guns for this game. I have seen classes on CTF, Sniping and just guns in general. The fact that the trials focus on sabers is a Star Wars thing. This is the Jedi Academy. Anyone who has ever played a first-person shooter knows how to fire a gun. *Yes I realize that guns are more complicated than that, and yes I realize there are ways to become better with guns.* Sabers and force powers are the things that sets this game apart. That is why they are the focus. |
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Buzz - Student 
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Why don't you go ask every JAK JAT Staff Member and JAC if they are perfectly happy with how things are or if there are some things they would like to change. _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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Sniya - Student 
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Oh course being an honouble jedi is more important being a good person is always more important.
oh and pepsi i cant help but say you get on my nerves this place is a sanctuary for jk2 players,a fountain of knowthedge and good spirt.And a stroke of genius by the makers. we have the best trainers,best mod,best script,best map And despite all of this you who has only been here for a very short time has decided that your going to complain. _______________ The real question is not whether machines think but whether men do. Bertrand Russell http://www.thejediacademy.net/forums_detail_page.php?f_id=970 |
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Pepsi - Ex-Student |
Bubu:
Ppl that have gotten high in rank are probably satisfied the way things are. I'm not, which means I have a lot to say, which means my posts grow long. Mohawk: I have been working on dueling a bit, and I've improved a bit as well (that is to say I've used something other than light style for the first time since I took down the lizard guy on single player. Sabers have no place in the gametypes I prefer, except for deflecting). Ofcourse I've noticed that things are centered around duelling. That's the original problem (problem being meant in a nice way here), since some students that want to play other gametypes or use guns a bit more get shoved aside by 'Jedi Purists' (like yourself) that refuse to use guns and simply aren't interested in anything but duelling. For an academy that wants to teach ppl to become good all round players, this is a bad thing. As for me becoming a Knight, I would say chances are ridiculously small in the near future, since knighthood (and even 'lesser' advancement) is done by duelling. That's the point I don't like. If the council wants top notch ctf trainers, then they should simply 'trial' them (like a clan would) and then appoint them trainers. About 90% of all good ctf players can't even do the special slashes if they get 3 attempts (and vice versa, I might add), so expecting one of the lasting 10% to join the academy and advance to trainer is like waiting for the moon to turn to cheese. About that class you attended... I don't know if it was the same class, but the first thing I did was to ask if I could do my exercises somewhere within view but out of the way from the others. I was told to get 'your ass back in line' in a rather blunt way so I pointed out (politely) what the problem was. Then I was told to shut up. This is where it got nasty. I don't think I'm the one to blame for this... Cheers /Pepsi PS. If I offended anyone with this post, I didn't mean to (and I don't understand how), so please explain to me what you think is offending and I'll remove it or explain myself so that everyone can be kept happy. This comment was edited by Pepsi on Feb 20 2003 12:08pm. |
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Masterw/AMohawk[JAP] - Ex-Student ![Masterw/AMohawk[JAP]](/image_thumbnail.php?f_type=users&f_width=51&f_height=70&f_image=Masterwmohawk.jpg)
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lol ioshee, that was like my least emotional post on the sunject so far  _______________ [Oi Oi Oi!!] |
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ioshee - Student 
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Masterw, be at peace. You have good points. Just don’t let Pepsi get you emotional. He doesn’t handle things in the best way sometimes that’s true, but maybe by our kindness we will encourage him to want to start handling them better.
Pepsi, A wise teacher once said to me that telling people to go to hell and making them look forward to the trip is true leadership (that is paraphrased, sorry.) I think the point is that if you want change, you should use manipulation instead of brute force, like cHoSeN oNe does. For every action there is an equal and opposite blah blah blah… you get the point. I mean that if you push, you will get resistance back. If you convince people that they want to go, then there will be no need to push. Bubu, You have a good point. Maybe it's like buying a big sports car to compensate for a lack of something else  J/K I post long sometimes too I guess. But not as long as Bubu.
Peace and… Banana on _______________ One of the Belouve boys This comment was edited by ioshee on Feb 20 2003 11:42am. |
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Masterw/AMohawk[JAP] - Ex-Student
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OK first of all, if you're so much better than everyone, it shouldn't take you long to do the work, and maybe get to Knight, at that point you could PROBABLY teach your own CTF class. You may be alot better then alot of the JAT's and JAK's in certain areas, that's great, do some work and prove it, teach your stupid class, and teach us all your superior techniques.
I don't know if you have noticed or not, but this place is really more centered around duelling. Now let's use a little common sense here, you said you still get whooped in duels...however you just 0wn all in CTF.... ok so since your duelling strategy isn't up to par... why not work on that while you're here and forget about all this stupid crap? My problem is not that I fear change, it's that I think your ideas in general won't pan out as good as you insist. If you want to come here and change everything, just go make your friggin academy. I really don't understand what your problem is....other than maybe you are ridiculously arrogant and think that your way is the best. There are things I myself would possibly change here myself, but I'm talking little things, why should we reform because YOU don't like the way things are done. I have been to classes that were so incredibly perfect, and then I've been to a few that were total hell, and I'll tell you something right now, it wasn't the JAT's doing in either circumstance, it was the people in the class that decided they wanted to listen and learn instead of goof off. You can't blame it on the techniques of the JAT's or the JAK's 100% of the time. I was also in a class once where the JAT/JAK had us doing drills in a somewhat...silly manner. We kept hitting eachother getting jammed in halls, etc. But instead of going "Hey this is stupid, you dumb JAK you're a retard we need to do this different wah wah wah", I just kept my mouth shut about it, and went to the back of the drill so I wouldn't keep getting sabered and trampled. I didn't have to say anything because it was pretty clear that the JAT/JAK realized for himself that a reform of their drills was in order. You have a somewhat ill way of proposing change btw, just like all those punks who run around saying "fuck racism", wtf is that supposed to mean? Yeah racism is bad, so let's say it AND make ourselves look like total blabbing, cursing, delinquent idiots in the process! At this point I wouldn't expect you to go much farther in the academy because you don't like the way we do things, you're impatient, you think your better and more intelligent that most of the people here, etc etc. It's common sense you don't spite the people that put you on top UNTIL they've put you there....if you act like this for the rest of your time here at the academy, who do you expect to nominate you for knight?? Who in the council do you expect will consider to bring you in as a JAT? _______________ [Oi Oi Oi!!] |
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Bubu - Hubbub 
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true... but he is the only exception i have seen _______________ make install -not war |
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ioshee - Student
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Not true Bubu.
The Highest ranking master here (my master) has the longest posts I've EVER seen. _______________ One of the Belouve boys |
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Ruuk Haviser - Retired 
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Bubu: point taken.
Pepsi: 1. Trust me, you aren't offending me RE: the stormstroopers, etc. I specifically don't use guns on sp anymore b/c it's basically - at the lower levels, at least - useless and boring. I just just slice through them like cheese while I move on to bigger and better (relatively speaking)enemies). Guns on-line is a whole different world and, I must say, quite fun in it's own way. 2. Hmmm. Ok. Well, I'm just going to leave this one up in the air because I don't feel I have enough information at this point to make an additional response. 3. Interesting. Well, again I'll have to withold comment. 4. Well, that explains some things. You were offended by some things generally said 1st because of the background and understandible baggage and experience you bring to the table. Others on JA found your abrasiveness (which is common and willingly expected on other sites) out of line with the commonly accepted verbal decorum (which, being rather new, you hadn't picked up on at the time). Ahhhh, yes. Just in real life, misunderstandings abound everywhere. Tell you what. I think there are people that are going to believe what they want to believe regardless of your, or definitely my, opinions on guns or sabers, honor or less honor, rp or no rp. Guess we'll have to just live with it. I suggest a truce with everyone, and offer that we all (Pepsi, you included) start out with a clean(-er) slate and try very hard to leave the verbal animosity out of the posts in the future. People will continue to disagree about things, no question. But if we could bring the fire-breathing down a few notches, I think Bubu and others would appreciate the shorter posts that would follow!
Deal? -rh _______________ Back from the dead... |
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Bubu - Hubbub 
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just an observation of mine:
the higher you go in rank, the shorter your posts become. _______________ make install -not war |
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Pepsi - Ex-Student |
Sigh. I'll never get to bed (6:58 am and ticking).
RH: 1. Actually I think this subject has been illtreated enough. What I should have said from the start was not that any gunner beats any saberist. I can probably beat anyone in a guns vs saber game (I'd be holding the gun, if that wasn't obvious), force or no force, but we all know the stormtroopers in single player can't (and believe me, there are actually worse players than that on some pubs). I hope noone feels offended by this, and if you do, send me an email on adde79@home.se and we can sort it out amongst ourselves. 2. Many students ARE interested in learning how to use guns, but the mentality of the academy is (seems to be, anyways) that is is somewhat improper (or 'unpure' or something, bad anyways). And the academy HAVE taken steps to "prevent students from getting utterly destroyed at guns FFA servers" (sareds words, not mine), so that part have also been met. 3. Different locations are hard to come by. Our clan has a server, but it's use is somewhat regulated, since it's a sponsorship deal, and we use it for playing matches and practising so the only really good place would be the academy's servers. 4. Zero was in no way blunt, while you were so gentle I missed it. As for whispy I explained my thoughts to her on irc. About chicken/egg thingie (this has also been posted by me before, so I'll keep it brief). On my first visit to this place I read the FAQ, question #1 (is TJA a clan?) which had some pretty stupid comments (stating TJA would rule all and dominate the world. If they wanted to, ofcourse) made on it that I found to be 'noobish', lame and offensive. This sort of shaped my first couple of posts here on the forums and it wasn't much of a shock when some ppl found it a bit offensive. So I guess it's fair to say I started the 'offensiveness', but not willingly. The posts I had read earlier (on the FAQ) was sort of 'rough' in language in a way I'm used to, so I used that tone, spiced up with longer posts and a bit of lone gunman (how fitting.  ) attitude.
I hope that answer was satisfactory, cause I'm honestly too tired to give one that's more fulfilling. Cheers. /Pepsi |
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ioshee - Student
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Pepsi, You could start your own Academy. Sure I know it might be slow at first, only teaching bots ctf technique. But eventually you would develop alternate personalities that you could teach as well
J/K don't shoot me. BTW you keep saying "gun on" Well I can't find the on/off switch on my gun  _______________ One of the Belouve boys |
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Ruuk Haviser - Retired
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Thank you for the welcome.
I have been reading many of your posts, actually, and understand most of what you're getting at. However, I'm not sure you fully understand a couple of the points *I* was trying to elaborate on. 1. Guns, sabers...there are times to use either one. I don't think one is better than the other *all* the time. I think it's been proven by you and several others that sometimes one wins out over the other, and vice versa. You have a preference to guns, and your response to this will say as such. No big deal. Different people like to use different things. 2. If JA and a large contingent of its members were interested in taking non-saber classes, I'm sure the public opinion would swing that way and the upper management (if you will) would have to seriously take that into consideration. But keep this in mind (and make sure to read some of my other posts) that this is supposed to mimic the "real" (right - just go with me on this one) Jedi Academy in the movies. As I've said before in my previous posts, the members of that Academy did not mess with guns. Not a question. A fact. And I would assume [people correct me if I'm wrong] a significant number of the JA membership like the way it's run - in line with the original idea of a Jedi Academy. 3. If there are other members of the JA that are interested in learning proper gun usage - who knows; I may be one of them...hey I'm always open to new things - perhaps you can teach this stuff at a different location. I understand your desire for change, but I think you're swimming against the tide if you are trying to do it *inside* JA. And continuing to hammer at it here time and time again, I think, may just be counterproductive to your points...as good (or bad, depending upon how people look at them) may be. 4. You seem to miss what Zero bluntly said, and I more gently suggested. I think your understandible defensiveness is coming from people attacking you. You said this yourself. But, maybe they feel you are attacking them first. A good example is what you just mentioned to Silent Whisper. From my perspective, she posted with a 3 out of 10 (firebreathing-scale) mentioning that she thought you have been redundant in your discussions/posts. Not necessarily a positive post, no. But your response (and this is the important point here, so don't miss it please) was more of a 9 out of 10. To Mohawk, a 9.5 out of 10. Both times, you criticised the person's intelligence. The person may hit you with a squirt gun, but that doesn't mean you need to open up with a BAR. Although you may have not liked what they had to say, and since I'm pretty new here I don't know all the past history swirling around, I would offer that if you want people to listen a little more carefully to what you are saying, you may want to tone-down your typing...indeed, at the very least, argue back with them on the *points* of the discussion. Don't insult their intelligence. It's just that in all the posts I've read that have you in it, yours are the ones that are, well, the most testy. Sometimes, I've found that you can be down-right nasty. And I've been wondering why. So, did the chicken come before the egg? Or was it vice-versa? Are people responding in ways to you that cause you to be defensive 1st, or are you yourself saying things that get the *other people* defensive 1st. It's a two-way street, remember. Again, I respect the points you are trying to get across, and may or may not agree with some of them. But we should limit our posts and comments to the topic, the discussion - the argument, sometimes - at hand. Not *go after* one another and attack the person making the comments. I look forward to your comments on this matter. -rh _______________ Back from the dead... |
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Buzz - Student 
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Actually when I do toy with guns I prefer to fight guns with guns and saber with saber. Thanks for being the most obvious guy around on the idea that a saber isn't very useful when fighting someone that is just going to run away. Its the same way when the other person has a saber too. The only difference is that niether person is going to get any hits. I said someone that knows how to fight using saber vs guns would do well. I didn't say I was that person. My personal opinion is you want to play with guns go play quake 3 or unreal tournament. I'm honestly not that interested in guns only or ctf except on rare occasions. And I'm really not interested at all in fighting you.
To get back to what this thread was about, What's more important to me is to have fun playing with other people than being the best at the game and needing to prove it all the time. _______________ When you are going through Hell, keep going. -Sir Winston Churchill. Those who seek power and control of others, no matter the level, no matter the intentions, should never be given it. |
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